Soviet Soviet & Eastern Block Quiz

[Piramida]

Unfortunatly Christian you got all 3 questions wrong, another thing that must be noted that this man was quite an oddity among his fellow comrades which can be seen in the fact that he studied philosophy in Paris and was from an old, bourgeois, Belgrade family. But he was a party member from 1933.

Oh yes and I also wanted to add that he as far as I know did not paint or sculpt, but he did make a certain contribution to this movement

Again, good luck

Ivan

Edited December 31, 2006 by Piramida

[Christian Zulus]

Dear Ivan,

sorry, I have to state a w.o. .

No idea, who this comrade might be .

Maybe Christophe, who lives in Paris, might find out, which famous YU-comrade studied philosophy at the Sorbonne .

Best regards

Christian

Unfortunatly Christian you got all 3 questions wrong, another thing that must be noted that this man was quite an oddity among his fellow comrades which can be seen in the fact that he studied philosophy in Paris and was from an old, bourgeois, Belgrade family. But he was a party member from 1933.

Oh yes and I also wanted to add that he as far as I know did not paint or sculpt, but he did make a certain contribution to this movement

Again, good luck

Ivan

[Christophe]

(...) Maybe Christophe, who lives in Paris, might find out, which famous YU-comrade studied philosophy at the Sorbonne .

(...)

I do like impossible missions ...

Ch.

[Christian Zulus]

I do like impossible missions ...

Ch.

Dear Christophe,

well, a short phone call + mail with the attached photograph to our embassy in Paris should solve the miracle within minutes. The staff in Paris speaks fluent French :

http://www.amb-serbie.fr/code/navigate.php?Id=2

But some of our diplomats are on holidays: 6th of january = X-Mas & 13th of january = New Years Eve .

My problem: I neither speak French, nor Srpski .

Best regards

Christian

[Christophe]

Hi Christian,

I have to let the others play!! If no answer at all... maybe I'll try .

So, to all : any suggestion ?

Ch.

[Christian Zulus]

Hi Christian,

I have to let the others play!! If no answer at all... maybe I'll try .

So, to all : any suggestion ?

Ch.

Gentlemen,

after waiting for a couple of days, I asked my friend Voja from Belgrade about that photograph. Here are the results:

1) Koca Popovic (full name: Konstantin Popovic), General, commander of the First Proletarian Brigade in YU, veteran of the Spanish Civil War, etc., etc.

2) "Narodni Heroj" = "National Hero" (so my guessing was right!)

3) Belgrade Surrealism http://www.serbian-corpus.edu.yu/ie/sample.../surr/surr.html

That is the Wikipedia-link about Koca Popovic (sorry, only in Serbian):

http://sr.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A%D0%BE%...%B2%D0%B8%D1%9B

Maybe my friend Voja should put the next question .

Best regards

Christian

[Piramida]

Bravo Christian!!!!

#1 and #3 are correct

but he was not one of the first people to recieve the national hero award the first people to get the narodni heroj were: Bosko Karalic, Stojan Grujicic, Filip Kljajic - Fico, Slavisa Weiner, Milan Ilic, Ratko Mitrovic, Rifat Burdzevic, Vladimir Knezevic, Miso Dudic, Dusan Jerkovic and Ivan Haris

The top generals usually only got the National Hero title at the end of the war or even many years later (like Koca who got his only the 27th of November 1953). The first people to get it were mostly of lower ranks, an example of this is that only two of the first 11 to get it are officers one a lieutenant and one a colonel

Another important thing to know about Koca is that he was the foreign minister of SFRY for 12 years and after that vice-president of the country, the first is much more important because he was the architect of Yugoslavia's foreign policy after the comintern split. He was also one of the recipients of the Order of Freedom (thats not the answer to number #2)

Ivan

P.S. If you guys want me to reveal the answer to number 2 please say and I'll be glad to oblige. Here is the english wiki link btw. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ko%C4%8Da_Popovi%C4%87

Edited January 5, 2007 by Piramida

[Christian Zulus]

Koca's award - multiple choice

Dear Ivan,

not bravo to me, but bravo to Voja in Beograd

So if it had not been the national hero, then it could have been:

- Order of the National Liberation

- Order of Bravery

- Order of the Partisan Star

- Order of Brotherhood and Unity

Was Koca among one of the first receipients of one of these four YU-orders?

Best regards

Christian

Bravo Christian!!!!

#1 and #3 are correct

but he was not one of the first people to recieve the national hero award the first people to get the narodni heroj were: Bosko Karalic, Stojan Grujicic, Filip Kljajic - Fico, Slavisa Weiner, Milan Ilic, Ratko Mitrovic, Rifat Burdzevic, Vladimir Knezevic, Miso Dudic, Dusan Jerkovic and Ivan Haris

The top generals usually only got the National Hero title at the end of the war or even many years later (like Koca who got his only the 27th of November 1953). The first people to get it were mostly of lower ranks, an example of this is that only two of the first 11 to get it are officers one a lieutenant and one a colonel

Another important thing to know about Koca is that he was the foreign minister of SFRY for 12 years and after that vice-president of the country, the first is much more important because he was the architect of Yugoslavia's foreign policy after the comintern split. He was also one of the recipients of the Order of Freedom (thats not the answer to number #2)

Ivan

P.S. If you guys want me to reveal the answer to number 2 please say and I'll be glad to oblige. Here is the english wiki link btw. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ko%C4%8Da_Popovi%C4%87

Koca and Tito:

[Piramida]

Yes Christian it is one of those four awards, the decree was issued on the 7th of December 1944.

and also bravo to Voja

[Christian Zulus]

Yes Christian it is one of those four awards, the decree was issued on the 7th of December 1944.

and also bravo to Voja

Dear Ivan,

I guess: Order of the National Liberation ?

That award was instituted on August, 15, 1943, only 262 awardees and very rare.

Koca is also one of the 7 awardees of the "Order of Freedom", the counterpart of the Soviet "Order of Victory" and the only YU-Award Tito wore in "full size" at his white uniform.

Best regards

Christian

[Piramida]

Nope not the national liberation good guess though if I didn't know the answer it would be the one I would have guessed but it's not the correct answer, think about it he had the rank of lieutenant general at the time so in my mind the next try should be the correct one

[Bryan]

I would guess he was in the first to get the Order of National Liberation!

[Christian Zulus]

Next try

Dear Ivan,

so, I will choose these two orders in a first step:

- Order of the Partisan Star 1cl

- Order of Brotherhood and Unity 1cl

Both orders Tito received in 1945. Both orders are for generals. Both orders are rare & prestigeous. But the Partisan Star with the golden wreath might be for an Partisan-General of more prestige .

I guess, that Koca had been one of the very first awardees of the Partisan Star 1cl.

As I read, he got another Partisan Star 1cl in later years.

BTW: Who is the actual owner of Koca's orders & medals? They would be a great display for a museum . Our Military Museum at the Kalemegdan in Belgrade doesn't have many orders .

Best regards

Christian

Edited January 6, 2007 by Christian Zulus

[Piramida]

Correct Christian he was one of the first 16 people to obtain the partisan star 1st class, and you are also correct that later he got a second one. I think that his awards are still in the possesion of his wife who lives in Belgrade, I've been thinking about contacting here just to see all his decoration's and there are many...

[Christophe]

Ivan and Christian,

Congratulations!!! This was a nice challenge, a good one!!!

Christian, your turn now ...

Cheers.

Ch.

[Bryan]

I've been thinking about contacting here just to see all his decoration's and there are many...

Wow, if you are able to do this and have permission to photograph them, it could be interesting in a Yugoslavian order reference book. Piramida, do you know by chance any good yugoslavian reference book?

[Christian Zulus]

Ivan and Christian,

Congratulations!!! This was a nice challenge, a good one!!!

Christian, your turn now ...

Cheers.

Ch.

Many thanks, Christophe .

But for 95 % it was the merit of my friend Voja from Belgrade .

So I am proud to post a new question . This time not dealing with Yugoslavia or dogs of the leaders, but with a (very) famous Soviet general of the GPW - guess who?

Give me 20 minutes for the posting ...

Best regards

Christian

[Piramida]

The only book that I have ever seen that I consider good when it comes to yugoslav communist awards is a book by a man named Stojan Rude? called "Odlikovanja Socijalističke Federativne Republike Jugoslavije". It was published in Belgrade in 1987 by "Slu?beni List"

Ivan

[Christian Zulus]

New reference book for YU-Awards ?

Wow, if you are able to do this and have permission to photograph them, it could be interesting in a Yugoslavian order reference book. Piramida, do you know by chance any good yugoslavian reference book?

Dear Soviet,

dear Ivan,

this is only one very small publication with bad photographs , Ivan mentioned.

I would make sense, to publish a decent guide and reference book of YU-Awards.

But a PMD-bible for YU-Awards would cost a fortune and a lot of research has do be done . It can be only done in a so called "public-private-partnership" and we have to wait, which government Serbia will have after the 21st of january 2007 and if they are willing to support such a project (maybe there might be also some money from the EU ).

The fact is, that the publication of an ultimate guide to YU-Awards might boost the demand for these items. So - seen as a business man - it would make sense, if the team, which publishes the reference book buys a rather large stock of interesting YU-Awards now, to sell them later and so to finance some of the costs of the book, by selling the awards later - after the publication.

Just my first thoughts.

Best regards

Christian

[Christian Zulus]

NEW QUESTION - GUESS WHO?

Gentlemen,

- who is that high decorated Soviet General of the GPW you can see at the attached photographs?

- what is so special about the first of his HSUs he got in GPW and for which deed did he get him?

- what is the nationality of that General?

BTW: That comrade promoted very fast through the ranks. He received his first HSU as a young colonel and finshed his military service as a General of the Army. So he also received a Suvorov 2cl and later a Suvorov 1cl.

O.K., for this time a very easy question, I think, to speed the procedure up a little bit .

Best regards

Christian

[Christian Zulus]

Famous General of the GPW

Gentlemen,

no idea, who that famous comrade could be ?

He got twice the HSU AND a Suvorv 2cl AND a Suvorov 1cl - besides a lot of other high-end decorations.

That young colonel ended up as a General of the Army - should have been an easy question .

Best regards

Christian

[Dragomir]

Next try

Dear Ivan,

so, I will choose these two orders in a first step:

- Order of the Partisan Star 1cl

- Order of Brotherhood and Unity 1cl

Both orders Tito received in 1945. Both orders are for generals. Both orders are rare & prestigeous. But the Partisan Star with the golden wreath might be for an Partisan-General of more prestige .

I guess, that Koca had been one of the very first awardees of the Partisan Star 1cl.

As I read, he got another Partisan Star 1cl in later years.

BTW: Who is the actual owner of Koca's orders & medals? They would be a great display for a museum . Our Military Museum at the Kalemegdan in Belgrade doesn't have many orders .

Best regards

Christian

Orders, decorations and medals of General K. Popovic are presently owned by his own legate in the Historical Archives of City of Belgrade. Several months ago I made a thorough survey of his awards.

Merry Christmas,

Dragomir

[Guest RedThreat]

Christian:

The general is Yakov Grigor'evich Kreiser. He was the first ground forces HSU during GPW. He distinguished himself defending Belorussian town Borisov where I was born and spent summers at my grandparents' house. In his memoirs, Guderian mentioned the trouble his forces had in Borisov fighting Kreiser's 1st Moscow Motorized Rifle Division armed with T-34s. Gen. Kreiser was Jewish just like I am.

Cheers,

Simon

Edited January 7, 2007 by RedThreat

[Dragomir]

Next try

Dear Ivan,

so, I will choose these two orders in a first step:

- Order of the Partisan Star 1cl

- Order of Brotherhood and Unity 1cl

Both orders Tito received in 1945. Both orders are for generals. Both orders are rare & prestigeous. But the Partisan Star with the golden wreath might be for an Partisan-General of more prestige .

I guess, that Koca had been one of the very first awardees of the Partisan Star 1cl.

As I read, he got another Partisan Star 1cl in later years.

BTW: Who is the actual owner of Koca's orders & medals? They would be a great display for a museum . Our Military Museum at the Kalemegdan in Belgrade doesn't have many orders .

Best regards

Christian

I found my notes. This is the list of awards of K. Popovic presently in Historical Archives of Belgrade:

Yugoslavian Orders, Decorations and Medals:

1- Order of the Partisan Star I (1944)

2- Order of the Partisan Star I (1945)

3? Order of the Partisan Star I (no Decree, dubious provenance)

4? Order for Bravery (1945)

5? Order for Bravery (no Decree)

6? Order of National Liberation (1945)

7? Order of Brotherhood and Unity (1947)

8? Order of Brotherhood and Unity I (1947, no Decree, probably substitution)

9? Order of Brotherhood and Unity (no Decree)

10-Order of the Yugoslavian Flag I (1954)

11-Order of the Yugoslavian Flag III (no Decree, perhaps belonged to K.P.?s wife)

12-Order of the Yugoslavian Flag III (no Decree)

13-Order of Freedom (no Decree)

14-Order of the War Banner (1954)

15-Order of the National Hero (1953)

16-Order of the Hero of Socialist Labour (1968)

17-Order of the Republic I (1961)

18-Order of Merit for the People I

19-Commemorative Badge for 1941.

20-Commemorative Badge for 1941.

21-Commemorative Medsal of Tito?s India and Burma State Visit (1954/ 5)

22-Commemorative Medal of 10th Anniversary of YPA

23-Commemorative Badge of the Union of War Veterans

Foreign Orders, Decorations and Medals:

Afghanistan:

24-Order of the Sardar-e-Ala

Argentina:

25-Order of May I (1954)

Bolivia:

26-Order of Condor of the Andes I

Brazil:

27-National Order of the Southern Cross I (1963)

Bulgaria:

28-Order of the National Liberation I

Burma:

29-Order of the Union I (the insignia by some error were stuck in same case with Ethiopian Order of Menelik; missing in the list of awards)

Chile:

52-Nationla order of Merit I (1962, HOURS, Santiago)

Czechoslovakia:

49-Order of the White Lion

50-Military Order of White Lion ?For Victory?

51-Military Cross 1939-1945

Greece:

30-Order of George II, I (1954)

Ethiopia:

31-Order of Menelik I (A.Bertrand, erroniously listed as ?Order of the Lion?)

Hungary:

34-Order of the Hungarian Flag I (1964)

Iceland:

32-Order of the Icelandic Falcon I (1960)

Italy:

33-Order of Merit for the Republic of Italy I (1965)

Mexico:

35-Order of the Aztec Eagle I (1960, broad band, LA ESMERALDA, MEXICO, HAUSER, ZIVY Y CIA CUCS.)

Norway:

35-Order of St. Olav I (1966)

Poland:

36-Grunwald Cross

37-Medal ?For your and our freedom? (1956)

40-Commemorative Medal for 20th Anniversary of Victory (1965)

Finland:

45-Order of the White Rose of Finland I (1963)

France:

46-Order of the Legion of Honour I (1956)

47-Order of the Lewgion of Honour III (1953)

Netherlands:

48-Order of Oranien-Nassau I (1972)

Spain (Republic):

53-Order of Liberty

54-Commemorative Medal of the YU Union of Veteras of Spanish Civil War 1936-1956

Sudan:

41-Order of Two Niles I (1st Version, GARARD, London)

42-Order of Two Niles I (identical as previous one)

Tunisia:

43-Order of the Republic I (1965; 2nd Version, A.BERTRAND)

UK:

44-HM Elizabeth II Coronation Medal (1953)

USSR:

38?Order of Suvorov I

39-Order of Suvorov II

You will note that the evidence of K.P. Legate is not in best order, and that there is some confusion regarding precise data. When I find some spare time, I shall try to make a complete review, with sketches and photographs.

Dragomir

[Guest RedThreat]

If you read Russian, you can enjoy Red Star's article about Kreiser published in honor of his 100th birthday.

http://www.redstar.ru/2005/11/12_11/5_01.html

Zhukov also mentioned Kreiser in his memoirs. Troops under Gen. Kreiser's command stopped Guderian's advance for 2 days. In the summer of 1941, such a slowdown of a German offensive was a major success for the Red Army. In his novel The Living and the Dead that depicts beginning of the war, K. Simonov also describes battles around Borisov.

Christian, thank you for bringing attention to my hometown hero. (-:

Cheers,

Simon