Nice photo of officer with interresting ribbon bar

[Deruelle]

Hi everybody,

I received this photo. There is no name on the back. I have a doubt about the second ribbon. I think about Prussian Life saving ribbon but not sure. Thanks for your help.

Christophe

[Deruelle]

Note that he has the ribbon for the Turkish War medal with device and the medal on the left of his tunic.

[Deruelle]

The close up of the shoulderboards

Christophe

[Guest Rick Research]

That angle of the shoulder board cipher baffles me. A Hauptmann, but of what? The TWO layers of Waffenfarbe make me think PIONIER, but that looks like a cipher, not a Battalion number.....

I think the second ribbon is a Prussian Crown Order from before the war (KO4), 3rd ribbon ? Saxon Albert Orders (SA3aX or SA3bX?), then a BZ3bX(mE? and just no proper device).

My first impression is that there are too many variables here with no clues to be able to identify him. He's got awards like a General Staff officer but he is NOT one.

[jaba1914]

Hi Christophe,

here the name:

Wilhelm Otto Max Kleinmann

*29.05.1876

+ Mai 1945

i have the same picture.

[Guest Rick Research]

Aha!

EK2, LD2, SA3aX, EH3aX...

that looks like an HH in there which we weren't aware of (BrK and MMV2 NOT on there before the foreign ones)

Hauptmann dR Pio Bn 8

He was also the NAZI "Commissar" over the REICHSBAHN--

Nazi "Leadership Staff" of the Reichsbahn, President Reichsbahn Direction Cologne June 1933 but July 1933 Standing Deputy of the General Director of the German Railways.

SA Oberf?hrer, Staatssekret?r in the Reich Transport Ministry, Prussian Staatsrat, and leader of the economic group "Transport" of the Four Year Plan.

I have his photo in SA uniform from the 1934 Reichsbahn Rank List-- will scan and attach that here.

he was a Baltic AND Silesian Freikorps member.

[Deruelle]

:jumping: Yahooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Many thanks Alex and Rick

Great

Christophe

[Guest Rick Research]

Pg. Kleinmann in his 1934 outfit for keeping an eye on railways employees and 1934 Beamten Verzeichnis:

[Tom Y]

Maybe , but an interesting bayonet. It appears to be a M88/94, but with a French M66 Chassepot quillon. I couldn't find anything similar in Janzen, but some of the 70/71 "reparations" bayonets were used for parts while most were converted to fit the Gew.98.

[Ulsterman]

1934 Reichsbahn list??????? :speechless1:

Where did THAT come from?

[Guest Rick Research]

Weitze in the Time Before Euros. I think he's still got a 1943 with broken spine in ratty condition from at least 10 years ago buried somewhere in his old, old stock... but not at this exchange rate. I'm kind of on "pause" for ME spending any more of my money JUST to give strangers free data. Kinda -- doesn't do, uh, anything for Ricky (I've noticed).

That's why I find myself confining myself more and more to answering fellow Research Gnomes/friends/active GMIC participants like Christophe or to encourage new members to BECOME active members and friends.

Becoming a Research Gnome takes longer!

Of course, one of the main ways to BECOME a Research Gnome is to amass a huge and you-never-know reference library. I think I've had this little volume about 15 years and only had "reason" to use it about 4 times! Turns out TODAY it was a good thing that I do have it gathering dust on a shelf. While it is difficult and expensive to track down obscure OLD books, there a QUITE a number of readily available bargain NEW reference books coming out all the time.

[Deruelle]

Hi Rick,

Again, thanks a lot for all infos you share with us.

Christophe

[webr55]

Weitze is offering his awards - including his double row ribbon bar:

[webr55]

with photo:

[webr55]

Wish I could get a better picture of the last (foreign) awards on his bar.

[webr55]

Ahhh.....

[webr55]

And a wonderfully clear view of the Olympia 2nd class device:

[webr55]

I think this is something for the devices gallery --- BTW could this be an unofficial FIRST class device?

[christerd]

Wow ! Thats a real stunning ribbon bar, what is the last three foreign awards ?

I can spot a Bulgarian Order of Merit with crown III I think, but the last three is

Super bar and very nice photos !!

Christer

[webr55]

Fourth to last - with two small crowns: Commander Order of Maurizius Lazarus, Italy

Third to last: ? (Commander grade device)

Second to last: ? (Commander grade device)

Last: Rising Sun or Danebrog? (Commander)

[Guest Rick Research]

Wonderful Olympics device-- have NEVER seen an enamelled one before. He did indeed get the First Class.

Alas cannot use that since does not belong to me or to someone who has given permission for it to be used.

The white with pale blue stripes ribbon is ? probably Yugoslav continuation of the Serbian St. Sava Order?

[Great Dane]

Wilhelm Kleinmann was awarded the Dannebrog Commander 1. class on the 24. July 1939 (I guess the 'wings' on the bar are - dirty - silver and gold).

/Michael

[webr55]

Wilhelm Kleinmann was awarded the Dannebrog Commander 1. class on the 24. July 1939 (I guess the 'wings' on the bar are - dirty - silver and gold).

/Michael

Ah - so a Grand Commander with star. Could well be silver and gold 'wings'. Btw - is there a complete list of recipients?

St. Sava could also be, yes --- pity the second to last one is quite faded.

[Great Dane]

Well... a complete list... just the State & Court Handbooks...

/Michael

[der-hase-fee]

Kleinmann's grouping is up for sale again ! This time at HH's.

Edited March 13, 2010 by der-hase-fee