Saxe-Weimar Five-Place Saxe-Weimar Medal Bar

[tyanacek]

Hello to all,

Here is a somewhat recent acquisition to my medal bar collection. This bar was to a commissioned officer from Saxe-Weimar. It features the Order of the White Falcon, Knight's Cross Second Class with Swords as well as a 1937-1939 pattern Red Cross Decoration Second Class. The Red Cross Decoration is actually a 1934-1937 pattern that was jeweler-modified to 1937-1939 standards. Also note the incorrect placement of the WW1 Commemorative Medal for Austria, before the 1914-1918 Cross of Honor. Another nice thing about this medal bar is that the 1914-1918 Cross of Honor is made of bronze rather than iron. Actually, it's the first non-magnetic Cross of Honor that I have ever seen.

Best regards,

Tom

[tyanacek]

Several months ago, I posted this bar on the WAF. Wouldn't you know that someone on that forum had a picture of the officer wearing this exact medal bar. The Leutnant also has an Italian Order of the Crown, pinned separately to his tunic, at the end of his medal bar.

Best regards,

Tom

[tyanacek]

a blowup of the medal bar:

Edited October 6, 2011 by tyanacek

[tyanacek]

Modified Red Cross Decoration:

[tyanacek]

new eagle over old:

[Claudius]

The medal bar to the medal bar in the photo looks like a perfect match to me. This is great! GMIC has witnessed this medal bar's transfer from owner to owner, but perhaps now with a photo, the bar has now found a home. There isn't a name perchance?

Could someone inform RR. I know he offered his research into this bar and would be very interesting at this new development.

NOTE: The felt backing is dark blue. I had thought this was generally reserved for navy or post-war uniforms. I will have to supplement my understanding of that guideline. Anyone's additional thoughts or clarifications on this?

Tom: You know what you have to now Tom, right? You have to get an Italian Order of the Crown to put along side this bar.

[Eric Stahlhut]

very nice bar; the bronze hindenburg cross is an added bonus, as these are considered to be rare. congrats!!

[David M]

the redcross cross is one of most beautiful crosses I have ever seen!

[M Hunter]

Dear Tom

An extremely nice addition to your already amazing medal bar collection. I find the fact that the Red Cross was "updated" very interesting. I have never seen or heard of this before. Again, well done, a real gem of history there.

I tend to agree with Claudius when he says you must retrieve an Italian Order of the Crown!

Best wishes

Matt

[tyanacek]

Thanks to everyone for the comments.

Unfortunately, I do not have a name for this Leutnant.

And, yes, I will need to get me an Italian Order of the Crown to make this complete.

Best regards,

Tom

Edited October 7, 2011 by tyanacek

[tyanacek]

Dear Tom

I find the fact that the Red Cross was "updated" very interesting. I have never seen or heard of this before.

Best wishes

Matt

Hello Matt,

Actually, I don't think the modification of the Red Cross Decoration is all that unusual. Pierce Fox has one just like it, in his collection. I would think that a good number of the unused 1934-1937 pattern decorations were modified in this manner. Why would they dispose of these obsolete patterns when, with just a little bit of modification, they could make the item completely serviceable again? This was nothing like the modern, disposable economy of today. For efficiency and cost-effectiveness, if something could be salvaged and re-worked then it was done. Also, a standard production 1937-1939 pattern Red Cross Decoration would have a plain metal reverse, without the white enamel.

Best regards,

Tom

[saschaw]

The photo of the bar's wearer posted here is still in my possession and available in my shop, as the bar's owner is apparently not interrested in it.

Go for it know, who knows when the bar will transfer to the next owner again. It then it might be any of you!

:whistle:

Edited October 8, 2011 by saschaw

[M Hunter]

Hello Matt,

Actually, I don't think the modification of the Red Cross Decoration is all that unusual. Pierce Fox has one just like it, in his collection. I would think that a good number of the unused 1934-1937 pattern decorations were modified in this manner. Why would they dispose of these obsolete patterns when, with just a little bit of modification, they could make the item completely serviceable again? This was nothing like the modern, disposable economy of today. For efficiency and cost-effectiveness, if something could be salvaged and re-worked then it was done. Also, a standard production 1937-1939 pattern Red Cross Decoration would have a plain metal reverse, without the white enamel.

Best regards,

Tom

Thank you for the explanation Tom. The replacement has been very well done on the cross.

Best wishes

Matt

[tyanacek]

The photo of the bar's wearer posted here is still in my possession and available in my shop, as the bar's owner is apparently not interrested in it.

Go for it know, who knows when the bar will transfer to the next owner again. It then it might be any of you!

Hello Sascha,

I will gladly buy this photo from you. I had no idea who owned the original or that it was even for sale.

Best regards,

Tom

PS: I sent you an email.

[azyeoman]

Congratulations Tom! What a needle-in-a-haystack story. I'm happy for you!

[tyanacek]

Yahoo! Sascha is sending me the photo of this Saxe-Weimar Leutnant. It will be wonderful to have this photo reunited with the medal bar. Thank you Sascha! :catjava:

[saschaw]

Gladly! I was really excited when I found the picture, as I, of course, knew the bar well.

Now to find the wearer! I think it's not easy, but the additional information (Italian order, photo taken in Rome) might help!

[Claudius]

Yahoo! Sascha is sending me the photo of this Saxe-Weimar Leutnant. It will be wonderful to have this photo reunited with the medal bar. Thank you Sascha!

My congratulations to you as well. That was very magnanimous of you Sascha.

[Ulsterman]

Fantastic. If its ok I shall take prints and mail them off to the bat cave for research. ok?

[David M]

new eagle over old:

is there a close up somewhere of the original eagle as well?

[tyanacek]

Fantastic. If its ok I shall take prints and mail them off to the bat cave for research. ok?

Hello Ulsterman,

That would be terrific. Feel free to use whatever pictures you like. If you need better pictures or scans of the photo, just let me know. And tell that researching genius that Tom says hello and wishes him the very best. He is sorely missed.

Best regards,

Tom

[tyanacek]

is there a close up somewhere of the original eagle as well?

Hello David,

Here is an illustration that I hope will help. On the left is the 1934-37 pattern. On many of these 1934-1937 issues, the eagle was not a separate piece but an integral part of the cross itself and the enamel of the eagle was flush with the surface of the white enamel in the cross arms. On the right is another example of a 1934-37 pattern that was modified to 1937-39 standards. (The new pattern eagle placed over the existing old pattern eagle.)

Best regards,

Tom

Both of these images can be found in:

Forman's Guide to Third Reich German Awards... and Their Values 2nd edition, pages 181 & 184 respectively. (photos credited to Dr. K.G. Klietmann)

[David M]

Ah I see, thanks for that. Although not a reall fan of the nazi era medals, I am very fond of this eagle on a white cross!

[tyanacek]

Ah I see, thanks for that. Although not a reall fan of the nazi era medals, I am very fond of this eagle on a white cross!

Hello David,

Yes, indeed! They really are pretty pieces.

Best regards,

Tom

[tyanacek]

Hello to all,

Yahoo! The photo arrived today. Thank you, Sascha, for selling this to me. I am very grateful. The piping on this guy's cap, tunic, and epaulettes looks pretty dark. I wish I knew what Waffenfarbe this is? It is also very difficult to make out the Regimental numbers on his epaulette. But what a great photo this is. I thought that this Leutnant might be a doctor, but there is no staff of Asclepius visible on his epaulette.

The inset at the lower left shows the stamp of the photo studio, from the back of the photograph.

Best regards,

Tom

Edited October 21, 2011 by tyanacek