dedehansen Posted March 10, 2013 Posted March 10, 2013 I´ve got this cross with some german awards from WW 2, is this possible ?
dedehansen Posted March 10, 2013 Author Posted March 10, 2013 Which class and model is it, and aws it awarded for military merit ( swords ) ? Regards Andreas
paul wood Posted March 12, 2013 Posted March 12, 2013 Andreas it is the Silver Merit Cross with Swords of the Order of St. Alexander, unfortunately it is difficult to suggest an exact time for issue, although given that the silver appears to be of good quality probably pre 1918. Paul
paul wood Posted March 13, 2013 Posted March 13, 2013 No enamel loss definitely Merit Cross with Swords, Paul
Graf Posted March 16, 2013 Posted March 16, 2013 Hi Andreas, This is 6-th Class of The Order of St Alexander with swords in the middle without a crown .... missing ribbon (Red, Triangular Austian type) This is war time -Military Division (the swords in the middle) -Perhaps was awarded to the German Officer during WW2 Because it is 6-th Class without crown the German Officer was with a low Rank. Since you got it with a group of other odrers form WW2 period -it is very likely King Boris III Model 1918-1943 It is very likely by German or Austrian manifacturer I cannot see any Marks therfore it is very likely silvered base metal Regards Graf
new world Posted March 17, 2013 Posted March 17, 2013 Medal looks like WWI manufacture. Here's same award with ribbon and case. Just because it came with German awards from WWII period doesn't mean it's made during Tsar Boris time. It could have been awarded to a German during, it was common practice.
paul wood Posted March 18, 2013 Posted March 18, 2013 Thanks for showing with case very nice indeed. Paul
dedehansen Posted March 19, 2013 Author Posted March 19, 2013 Thanks Gentlemen, now I know which ribbon is missing and what I have to look for. Is it also possible that it was awarded to an senior NCO, all Bulgarian orders that I have seen which were awarded to german officers had enamel. My hope was that there were different modells, this one with Date 1878 ? Andreas
new world Posted March 20, 2013 Posted March 20, 2013 The design stayed the same for most of the time this award existed. One major change was when the crown was replaced with the wreath (when the regime changed from monarchy/regency to republic), but that doesn't apply to your award w/o crown.
dedehansen Posted March 23, 2013 Author Posted March 23, 2013 Thanks, so it is possilbe that the decorations belog together, they came all from private. Regards Andreas
new world Posted March 26, 2013 Posted March 26, 2013 It's absolutely possible these medals are all to the same person, but we will never know for sure without documents.
ruiz Posted October 21, 2016 Posted October 21, 2016 I have this Alexander order III class. The ring have the inscription "SILBER"...german manufacturer ( Pforzheim)? Best regards
Graf Posted October 21, 2016 Posted October 21, 2016 (edited) Hi Ruiz, Yes, you are right It is a nice Commander -German Made in rare Silver variation -Boris III Emission.. Most of them were made from gilded bronze I cannot see any ribbon loop ??!! I can see part of a ribbon.Very rare i have seen maker marks on the German made ones.Most of them were made by C.F. Zimmermann , Pforzheim The French made one had the French mark for silver -"boar head" and the Austrian had the Austrian silver marks "dog head with AA" and usually with the makers mark Here is a nice Austrian made Commander by Rothe Edited October 21, 2016 by Graf
ruiz Posted October 22, 2016 Posted October 22, 2016 It is entirely made of silver? I think it's manufacturer Zimmermann, Godet makes some Orders and badges too. You have a very nice Order, I love the box.
Graf Posted October 22, 2016 Posted October 22, 2016 Hi, Those crosses are really Silver gold gilded/ Godet made much less numbers of Bulgarian Orders then Zimmermann.Interesting fact about Godet is that he not always follow the strict design of the Bulgarian Orders Here are couple of Zimmermann made St Alexander Crosses Both , like yours, are marked Silber Here is also unmarked Godet made GC Star - notice that he used swords from a German Order, which he used to make as well
ruiz Posted October 22, 2016 Posted October 22, 2016 Very impressive Orders! I have this awards makes by germans. Observer badge make by godet ? Zimmermann ?
Graf Posted October 23, 2016 Posted October 23, 2016 Here is a French made Officer Class with the "boar head" French mark for Silver The box is for the 5th Class, however that the way the Order came, however it is typical French original box Notice the typical for the French orders letter "F" on the reverse medallion ..and in my opinion the front central red enamel is different from the enamel of the Austrian made Orders, however this is only my opinion
ruiz Posted October 23, 2016 Posted October 23, 2016 A question. it's possible to find the manufacturer of the order if has not some kind of marks ? Best regards
Graf Posted October 23, 2016 Posted October 23, 2016 Hi RUIZ, For the Bulgarian Orders it will be very difficult, because they are not very well researched as many other decorations from Europe For example the German Iron Cross could be identified without the Maker Mark, simply because it is one of the most researched Decorations and there are many books and experts in the field. Regarding the Bulgarian Orders the only thing that could be identified is the country of the Maker and in very rare cases the Maker himself, simply by the typical way of making and by typical parts used for making the Decorations The most difficult period is the Republican one, because many private Bulgarian Makers were involved into the making of the Bulgarian Orders and Decorations I hope this will be of some help
ilieff Posted October 23, 2016 Posted October 23, 2016 Very nice order, Graf. A noticeable difference between the French and Austrian made crosses (for this period) is the loop - French ones have double decorative loop, while Austrian examples - a spherical-shaped one. It is indeed very difficult to find out who the maker was. The order of St Alexander is probably the most diverse (in terms of emissions and variations) order in Bulgarian history and many of the badges were not marked at all.
Egorka Posted October 23, 2016 Posted October 23, 2016 Hello, I have a question. A friend of mine has this St. Alexander order and the Star. I understand it is III class Commander Cross (as only III class can be in green enamel, right?). But it comes without star, no? So this ensemble he has makes no sense then, as it did not exist. Also he was curious if it is possible to trance who was awarded with this order. Is it anyhow possible?
new world Posted October 23, 2016 Posted October 23, 2016 1st class set looks good, not sure why you say it didn't exist. The cross is not the same as for 3rd class. It's the same size and both had green enamels, but differences are in center red medallion - 3rd class has lion in the center, while 1st class has elaborate name "St Alexander" in the center. Unfortunately it's almost impossible to know the name of the awarded, unless you have document or box is labeled with the name. In this case only name and the grade is on the label.
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