saschaw

The cross itself is absolutely okay fur sure, but I don't know about the engraving. It may be good, but I cannot say for sure. I rather tend to like it.

Are those not the guys to get even more awards than those who risk their lives in danger?

Thanks Gentlemen for the additional information. PS: I think you may be right about him being rather Feuerwehr than police, though it's strange he doesn't wear any Feuerwehr awards. May be his "bravery awards only" set.

Thanks Gentlemen for clearing this - so I was right in all points whereas my friend wasn't. Hehe, yeah ... I saw once a Bavarian bar with even the Landwehr service award IInd class outranking the EK II ... If someone wants the photo and has something nice from Baden, he shalt PM me ...

I got this photo recently on eBay.de. It shows an police man from "L?bau (Sa.)", ergo from Saxony. I'd say he wears besides EK I and EK II only royal Saxon awards in a tuxedo style - on his uniform. The awards are: Preu?en, Eisernes Kreuz 1914 I. Klasse; Preu?en, Eisernes Kreuz 1914 II. Klasse; Sachsen, Friedrich August-Medaille; Sachsen, Albrechtsorden, Ritterkreuz II. Klasse mit Schwertern; Sachsen, Verdienstorden, Ritterkreuz II. Klasse mit Schwertern; Sachsen, Silberne Milit?r-St. Heinrichs-Medaille; Sachsen, Milit?r-St. Heinrichsorden, Ritterkreuz. I guess this an rather special combination though Saxons are used to wear several more bravery awards than soldiers from other states. I cannot remember ever to have seen a Badener with more than three Baden bravery awards, so five from his own state may be the most to get in one war - and only(?) possible in Saxony. If someone gave me a nice portrait from Baden he might get this one, I actually don't collect Saxony but just had to take it ... PS: a friend of mine claimed the last decoration rather to be a Romanian crown order, but from the ribbon and the order - it is the first award as it's from right to left - it is a MSH, is'n it? I'm actually sure ...

If you mean that one I think, you're wrong. That has a very different ribbon, as you can see here. But there are sooooo many awards on a red ribbon ...

Yes, all correct from what I see. The 7th decoration is a W?rttemberg long service award. Am I right the Prussian REO and Bavarian MMO are both peace time awards? So they should be behind the Hanseatic cross, shouldn't they ... ?!

The Red Cross medals are usually sandwiched with something else. I've seen it often but still don't know why and what would sandwich them - apparently "anthing" would do. Are the Jerusalem Cross' medaillons real gold or gilt? They should be _gold_ for a good one. Those crosses have been heavily faked since (I guess) the 70s and hardly ever found as real ones, especially on such a bar. The Prussian experts should be able to help, with these or maybe better pictures. From what I know, the cross was given to those who were with the Kaiser in Jerusalem in 1898. As I said, others sould see if good or bad, my feeling for it is'n good, but yet just a feeling.

From what I know, he wasn't wrong. But as I'm not too much into Bavarian system, could someone clearify, please?

Gentlemen, we're missing Baden, what a shame ... Here's a "Kreuz f?r freiwillige Kriegshilfe":

Aaaaah, bad question. I like everything in my collection ... but this one may be the best - and haven't shown it yet. A Baden bravery medal, awarded in 1849 to a Prussian NCO. Conditions not too good, seems to be proudly worn. Edit: regarding Post #11 - Mike, what indicates that oak leave on the Ottoman ribbon? I've got exactly the same as mini device on a Hessian Ribbon bar, thought it was rather unofficial ...

Though I rather agree with christerd - for me it's a lady's set, too. Of course those are not often seen - as they're insane rare. These may be the awards to a high ranking Bavarian Lazarettschwester, may be a Lazarett boss'. Ever seen a man wearing more than one award in full size witth bow ribbon?! All I've ever seen were single Iron Crosses worn on such lapels on wedding photos, never a set of full sized red cross awards ... Here's a similar set from my father's collection, which for me a lady's set as well:

Thanks, now _these_ pictures should help. The bar itself _is_ good, no doubt about it - nice war time or early 1920s bar made by Godet. I don't like the Jerusalem cross - neither the cross and nor that there is such a cross on this bar, at this position. A red ribbon an a large German bar, 2nd to last place and sandwitched by two foreign awards should actually be - yes, something foreign, too. I've got no idea if Austrian, French, or whatever - but not a Jerusalem Cross. PS: though one of the best and most interresting bars I've seen for a while ...

Not too difficult as it's the same as used for the silver merit emdal with ~ 170,000 awards in WWI ... Well, I wasn't talking about _numbers_ but about the status - it was a "highest bravery award" as Prussian Order Pour le Merite, Golden Military Merit Cross, Bavarian Military Merit Medal etc. were.

The pictures ain't good, but I like the bar. Looks like a nice war time bar, about 1915 to 1918 ... Means you found him?! I'd wonder you found the right one, as ... you've been looking for the wrong awards ... It's an Allgemeines Ehrenzeichen, no Red Eagle order - and it is a Prussian Milit?r-Dienstauszeichnung I. Klasse on last place ... yes, it's a pre 1913 ribbon and an old NCO who didn't mind about it. Well, why should he exchange his 21(?) year award for a new 15 year cross?

Yes, hardly ever seen an unchipped one. Actually I don't mind too much with those old. Methinks the same. I sat at Thies auction some years ago, an old Knight's cross IInd class in gold as shown above, but without swords was limited about 800,- Euro and finished with approx. 3k ... PS: I'm still looking for a MVO 4th class 1905 to 1914 type without swords ...

Noooo, isn't you bar missing a Milit?r-VerdienstKREUZ ?! Those are in silver and cheaper ...

Signalmeister J. Winkler beim Kommando der Hochseestreitkr?fte - BZL4 on 23. Mai 1918. I'll e-mail Daniel on the roll issue and open another thread for my BZL3bX/BZL4 ribbon bar as soon as I'm trew the list ...

Hey, you're good - it _is_ one of those. Worst eCrap ever of course, though it illustrates what I wanted to explain - and not everyone has such nice pictures as stogie does ...

Hey, that's great ... von Sommerfeld und Falkenhayn's later bar has as well, see #131 ...

I have no picture but can explain you what it looks like. The old "4th class" actually was called "Ritterkreuz II. Klasse". Is was made of Gold, was blue enemaled but had no flames between the arms - that's it. This class was one of the originals, instituted in 1866. The swords came just in 1891, so noone wore swords before, even if awarded for bravery. The ribbon was the white and blue one ("Friedensband") up to 1913 for all versions, swords didn't matter. I finally found a picture, unfortunally a baaaaad cross. Though you can see what about it should look like ...

I think it's none of both. It's rather not a very good modern copy but a modern copy ...

It's rather faided, isn't it? Sure you didn't? I finally found a rather bad picture of ours and am pretty sure it came here up before, at least once!

A GREAT bar if it is 100% okay and not played with or worse. It has some deatils I really like as well as some I don't ... better poictures of the insane rare Jerusalem cross would be nice, too.

Seems not to be Burg Hohenzollern - or is it? If not, where then? :love: