Show your Imperial officier' shoulderboards

[dwmosher]

To keep the original thread going, here is another interesting piece.

Chip:

How about a M-1915 board worn on either the friedensuniform or kleinerrock for the Minenwerfer Abteilung assigned to Nachrichtentruppen Kommandeur of I.D. 22.

Dave

[Tom Y]

My contributions. Hopefully someone can ID them for me. The first one, the crown appears to be Bavarian, but no trace of blue thread.

[Tom Y]

And this Saxon one. Anyone know what the BL means?

[Guest Rick Research]

#77: Third Reich Schutzpolizei Oberst?

[Tom Y]

Getting back off the track, a pair of Pioner Litzen.

[Tom Y]

#77: Third Reich Schutzpolizei Oberst?

So the crown would be an "unofficial" addition?

[Chip]

Tom,

The crown would be an erroneous addition. No crowns that I can think of on Nazi era boards. Someone just stuck it on there. Your second strap is also altered. It started life as a Saxon junior medical officer's (doctor) board. The "BL" is, in my estimation, a civilian device, once again, added at some later date. Attached is a picture of a similar Saxon board, to give you an impression of what it originally looked like. This one is the M1915 field pattern, while yours would have been for Kleiner Rock or Friedensuniform.

Dave,

The underlay on the MW officer's board is black. Sorry if it looks like dark green. This is a standard pattern MW board. I also have this officer's black velvet/silver bullion sleeve patch that would have been worn just prior to this pattern of strap being introduced.

Edited October 31, 2005 by Chip

[Chip]

Here is a Bavarian Feuerwerksoffizier. The underlay is black.

[Tom Y]

Tom,

The crown would be an erroneous addition. No crowns that I can think of on Nazi era boards. Someone just stuck it on there. Your second strap is also altered. It started life as a Saxon junior medical officer's (doctor) board. The "BL" is, in my estimation, a civilian device, once again, added at some later date. Attached is a picture of a similar Saxon board, to give you an impression of what it originally looked like. This one is the M1915 field pattern, while yours would have been for Kleiner Rock or Friedensuniform.

Hmm, As you can see, the crown appears to have been there for a long time.

On the other board there are no "ghosts", but on the back there are "bug bites" under the tabs of the BL. Curiouser and curiouser.

[Chip]

Tom,

This crown does not look like they typical imperial era shoulder board crown. Most of them were stamped. The only ones I have seen that are flat on the back are those for the extra thick cyphers and crowns, which varied according to regimental standards. Whatever it is, the board itself is not imperial. As you say, these devices appear to have been on your boards for a while. One can plainly see that, but while interesting, it really doesn't mean much.

Chip

[dwmosher]

Tom:

Without state flecking and with a green base, I'm with Chip. Although they have been there a long time, I don't think the crowns were original to the boards. By the way, your pioneer collar tabs are actually for the Garde-Pioneer Batln ( a few other technical eisenbahn, telegraphen, luftschiffer and kraftfahr units) for enlisted prewar overcoats. Regular pioneer and other technical units had just a black tab w/o litzen.

Chip:

I'm confused about the green underlay...Black velvet base and red second piping were the colors for M-15 pioneer officer boards.

Dave

[Tom Y]

Tom,

This crown does not look like they typical imperial era shoulder board crown. Most of them were stamped. The only ones I have seen that are flat on the back are those for the extra thick cyphers and crowns, which varied according to regimental standards. Whatever it is, the board itself is not imperial. As you say, these devices appear to have been on your boards for a while. One can plainly see that, but while interesting, it really doesn't mean much.

Chip

Thanks, Chip. I'll go with the Good Twin's SchuPo, one of 54 in 1941. And it's now got that bleedin' shadow

Edited October 31, 2005 by Tom Y

[Tom Y]

Tom:

Without state flecking and with a green base, I'm with Chip. Although they have been there a long time, I don't think the crowns were original to the boards. By the way, your pioneer collar tabs are actually for the Garde-Pioneer Batln ( a few other technical eisenbahn, telegraphen, luftschiffer and kraftfahr units) for enlisted prewar overcoats. Regular pioneer and other technical units had just a black tab w/o litzen.

Chip:

I'm confused about the green underlay...Black velvet base and red second piping were the colors for M-15 pioneer officer boards.

Dave

Thanks, Dave. My ignorance of insignia is encyclopaedic.

[Chip]

Dave,

I'm sorry. I thought your original comment said something about a Nachrichten Abteilung and therefore you thought that the underlay was dark green. I guess I don't know what you meant.

Chip

[dwmosher]

Chip

Sorry; I confused myself. What a brain f*rt. Lets just go back to where I kinda knew what I was talking about. A M-15 minenwerfer board for either the Friedensuniform or the kleinerrock....

Dave

[Glenn J]

Hi Rick,

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?s=&showtopic=2...indpost&p=22287

I guess we'll find out when somebody gets a copy of this

http://gmic.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=2573

I received the German language copy of the new Kraus/Schlicht Reichswehr book today. Very impressive it is as have been the previous publications from Verlag Militaria.

They confirm that the medical officers and veterinary officers of the "Provisional" Reichswehr in the period 1919/1920 continued to wear the pattern of patches introduced by the A.K.O. of 21.9.15 for the Bluse M1915.

Regards

Glenn

[Mike Dwyer]

An interesting thread . . . on something about which Inknown absolutely nothing.

Years ago, not even sur ehow, I acquired a pair of shoulderboards. Have always assumed they were "German", but never knew. If I never ask, I'll never know, I guess.

Here they are. As I say, I have no clue. (Not the world's best scan, sorry.)

Ref #64, these are indeed, US Army officer's. They are still worn today on the Army mess uniform for formal occasions, but the rank is not worn on the shoulderboards, they are plain, the rank is worn on the lower sleeve (see rather poor photo below) just below the trefoil knot for company and field grade officers, and above the oak leaf embroidery for general officers. The lady in the middle is wearing the enlisted mess jacket with rank insignia on the sleeve and service stripes on the lower sleeve.

[attachmentid=18217]

[Ramblinfarms]

I have a single Col's Board (Two large gold pips, twisted silver dull cording with thin black "V"s)with a kind of hot pink underlay similar to Rick's post #7. The Pink is a little darker than Rick's TR Board, but still that kind of hot pink. The board is massive and heavy, with thin black "V"s in the cording. The board is a slip on, but also has one of those black elastic loops at the end of the Board where the button would go through, sewn in between the underlay and the cording.

Sorry I can't post a pic., but can anyone take a crack at what I have? Prussian General Staff or TR F.D?

[Guest Rick Research]

I've never seen a matte finished Feuerwehr board. The fact that yours is subdued is a good first impression that it is indeed General Staff.

[Ramblinfarms]

Thank you Rick. Yes indeed, the cording is a dull silver. It doesn't look like it was ever bright silver in finish. The carmine underlay is very bright except where it has faded along the edges. Maybe Santa is brnging me a scanner or a dig Camera.

Thanks again for your assistance.

Edited December 6, 2005 by Ramblinfarms

[Ramblinfarms]

Here is another description of an interesting pair of slip ons. Major's boards with white underlay, Number 64 in gold numbers. But when you look at the boards carefully, the "V's are half black and half red. Wurttenburg? The pair was sold to me as Prussian. The "64"s have been on there forever, and there are also some extra holes where another device was attached prior to the numbers being put on there. Overall nice and salty "been there" boards, with a lot of patina and verdigris to the numbers.

What do you think?

[Guest Rick Research]

I hope you've been good because now you DO need a scanner-- because 1 picture will be worth trying to figure out precisely what 1,000 words couldn't describe precisely enough.

[Ramblinfarms]

I'll be extra nice to santa!!! It kills me not to be able to fully participate in these most interesting threads.

[Hauptmann]

Hi all,

Don't know how I missed popping these in here. Hauptmann in Grenadier-Regiment K?nig Karl (5. W?rttembergisches) Nr.123:

Dan :cheers:

[Chris Boonzaier]

Does anyone have any bavarian Schwere Reiter boards to show?

Thanks

Chris