Some advice and a "Hello"

[A Collector]

Hi all,

I just signed up here today! I was referred here by a forum member for some input on a medal bar. I would like some opinions please on this:

Overall the bar looks very nice to me, and with such an uncommon combination, with Noncombatant EK II and FJC...is it possible to trace?

Sincerest thanks in advance, and I am glad to be here.

[Ulsterman]

In a word, "no".

There is no list of EKs awarded from 1914-18.

Also, there's a bit of a policy not to comment (and identify the owners of) on bars that are on the market, or at least in auction, as it influences events.

Edited May 1, 2008 by Ulsterman

[A Collector]

So no opinions on this bar are allowed until after it is sold?

[GeorgeCL]

I see NO problem with asking for a second opinion of an item before sinking lots of $$$ on it.

Sorry I cant comment on the Bar, Its not my field.

Welcome to the forum and I'm sure someone could comment it.

George

[A Collector]

I see NO problem with asking for a second opinion of an item before sinking lots of $$$ on it.

Sorry I cant comment on the Bar, Its not my field.

Welcome to the forum and I'm sure someone could comment it.

George

Thank you very much Geroge for the words, and the welcome.

[Mike Huxley]

So no opinions on this bar are allowed until after it is sold?

Welcome to the Forum. This bar would not be possible to trace with only these awards and no supporting documentation. Also in my opinion it's over priced for what it contains.

Cheers, Mike

[A Collector]

Welcome to the Forum. This bar would not be possible to trace with only these awards and no supporting documentation. Also in my opinion it's over priced for what it contains.

Cheers, Mike

Hi Mike, thanks. So the price is on the heavy side even with the noncombatant EK II? Also, would I be correct in saying that this probably belonged to a Dr.? I am thinking that it was because the FJC w/crown was only awarded to officers...

Thanks again,

Steve

Edited April 30, 2008 by A Collector

[scottplen]

I agree a tad high seems ok thought ! I had one dealing with this seller and seems to be a pretty good guy ! I would email him and try and get more details on this item! I think he tries to have quality stuff !

but remember even dealer Fall prey to rip off artists!

I would ask if he has a money back policy ??? or a 10 day inspection ???

welcome to this forum

The right place to seek advice !!!

[Guest Rick Research]

The point raised about calling attention to something YOU might want to bid on and attracting competition is entirely valid, as far too many people have learned to their regret.

This is a very odd combination. Haven't a clue about whether the Serbian/Yugoslav medal on the end was even possible to a German recipient, pre-1914 or post-1918.

The Noncombatant Hindenburg Cross indicates the wearer wore SOME sort of military uniform during the war. He was a civil servant in 1938 with less than 40 years of service in.

The combination at first suggests something Red Cross related-- a wartime zinc Prussian Red Cross Medal from 1915+... the "white black" Iron Cross.

What (leaving aside that last medal, about which I know NOTHING) is VERY hard to explain are the two Austro-Hungarian awards. The Gold Merit Cross with Crown was awarded to very junior officers/officer equivalents-- say, the equivalent of a Leutnant. But the Red Cross medal with War Decoration is the BRONZE class, given to privates and corporals. I don't see how anyone could have bridged that gap in the course of the war, in this sort of career--.

I'd suspect some sort of war's duration medical supplies sort of administrative official.

It looks original, but there will be no way to identify the owner.

[A Collector]

Thanks for the very detailed reply Rick. I really do appreciate the help. Thanks to everyone else as well for the welcome and comments.

Steve

[saschaw]

It looks original, but there will be no way to identify the owner.

And that's the problem. The bar is eCrap at it's worst, and without some members here remembering it, it will get "original" at some point, earlier than I exspectet/feared it. Do you know an "am-militaria" from Vienna... ? He's the one and only former wearer and owner of this bar...

And in clearer words, for a new member (welcome to GMIC, btw ) - this medal bar is a modern put together by a faker from Austria who makes, ?hm, well ... "interresting" medal bars...

Worth the parts by no cent more, and even for the parts price I wouldn't buy this bullshit. I'm not blaming Barry, he's an honest guy from what I know. He just didn't know - as all other here didn't, what makes me thinking...

Edited May 1, 2008 by saschaw

[Schießplatzmeister]

Hello A Collector and welcome:

I would just like to add a few comments about my interaction with the current seller of the piece in question.

First I would like all to know that I have no personal or business relationship with the seller and that my comments are unsolicited. We must all remember that the seller sells a wide range of items. It is therefore difficult for him to be a specialist in all areas and to know everything about these types of items. His return policy which is posted on his website is very fair. In my previous personal interactions with him (both buying and selling), I have found him to be a man of his word. There was a recent post regarding questionable RAO IV pieces that he offered. As soon as he became aware of their dubious origin, he took appropriate action (according to the postings).

Saschaw is completely correct regarding his comments. As Saschaw pointed out, unfortunately, once pieces change hands a few times, their true history becomes obscure. Complete garbage becomes legitimized in this way. Sadly, the forgeries are getting better in this area of collecting. I believe that the future is not good in this regard either. As "values" of these items rise, the criminal forgers get better at their game.

This forum is a great aid to all collectors as the information can spread regarding what is good and more importantly, what is not good!

Best regards,

"SPM"

[A Collector]

I must say that I am very surprised by the findings. It is very sad indeed when the level of fakery includes soiled/worn ribbons. I am very surprised as it looks so veeeery convincing in its construction. I am however thankful for the help I have received here. My thanks to you all.

Steve

[Stogieman]

Actually the real clue here should have been the out of place Austrian award on a war ribbon smack in the middle of the group.

[Guest Rick Research]

No, far weirder things than that happened at the time.

What set off my radar was the peculiar PAIR of Austro-Hungarian awards.

[VtwinVince]

Yup, it's also weird that this group has no Austrian or Hungarian WW1 commemoratives, seeing as it is allegedly a post-1934 bar.

[A Collector]

Thanks again to all who posted. I had this on hold, but explained to Barry the descrepancies. He was very gracious and understanding as he is a class act IMHO.

If anyone here knows of a good source for Imp. medal bars in the $600.00-$700.00 range, please send me a PM. Im looking for something not rare, or large, but something not so common. Maybe a Crown order or RAO in the mix. Most appreciative thanks again.

Steve

Edited May 1, 2008 by A Collector

[Ed Maroli]

I have never purchased anything from emedals and have heard nothing except good comments about him, ....... but many of his Third Reich/Imperial bars are post war creations. He always seems to have medal bars with impossible Eastern people, Croation, or some other minor axis power combination.

Just my opinion. ~Ed

[Wild Card]

I must say that I am very surprised by the findings. It is very sad indeed when the level of fakery includes soiled/worn ribbons. ...

Steve

Hi Steve,

As the man said "You ain't seen nuthin yet".

Welcome to The Forum and when it comes to fakes et al., take comfort in the fact that you are not collecting Soviet -

those guys are real professionals.

Wild Card

P.S. Barry (e-medals), in my opinion, is as honest as they come; but, while very knowledgeable, no one knows everything

about Imperial German; and when you deal with "world wide", there are limitations.

Edited May 3, 2008 by Wild Card

[Stogieman]

Maybe something NCO'ish? I here there's a possibility that the Lubek Rolls might be done soon... that means there's apossibility of ID'ing this fellow someday...

[A Collector]

Maybe something NCO'ish? I here there's a possibility that the Lubek Rolls might be done soon... that means there's apossibility of ID'ing this fellow someday...

Very, very nice.....but I just spent my "allowance" (and then some ) on the White Falcon bar that Noor posted for sale. That was Father's Day, Birthday, and the next two Christmas'....

Thank you guys

[Stogieman]

Lucky Dog! I was wondering who snatched that one.... It's a great bar!

[A Collector]

Lucky Dog! I was wondering who snatched that one.... It's a great bar!

I have admired that bar since I first saw it on another forum....I NEVER thought I would own it. It took moving some items from the collection, but well woth it I think. This definitely goes into the "No Sale" category.

[saschaw]

Sorry Gentlemen, but that's one more eCrap bar. Please ask before buying...

Do you want to know who made this one...?

[Stogieman]

Saschaw, what are you talking about? Not the White Falcon Bar???????????