Flügeladjudant Oldwig-Albrecht von Natzmer

[Solomon]

Hello gents,

I just realized, that I didn´t share so far this ribbonbar here, although I already have it a long time in my collection.

This ribbonbar belongs to Oldwig-Albrecht von Natzmer, born 29th November 1879 and died 30th May 1927.

Career:
since 1893 1st Garde-Reg. zu Fuß as Seconde-Lieutnant
since 1902 Oberleutnant
in 1908 promotion to Ordonanzoffizier at the Prince Lippe-Detmold
since 1909 Hauptmann
since 1912 Flügeladjudant of Prince Leopold IV. of Lippe-Detmold
since 1916 Major
since 26th November 1918 retirement

The ribbonbar shows
- iron cross 2nd class 1914
- war merit cross Lippe-Detmold
- red eagle order 4th class
- Centenar-medal
- Bavarian military merit order 4th class
- Saxony Albrecht-order 3rd class with crown
- Mecklenburg Greifen-order 3rd class with crown
- Brunswig house-order 3rd class
- Saxony Ernestinian house-order
- House-order Lippe-Detmold 4th class A or Schaumburg-Lippe house-order 4th class
- Norwegian Olav-order 3rd class.

Oldwig-Albrecht von Natzmer also received
- Lippe Detmold Kriegervereinskreuz
- Lippe Detmold Officers cross
- Lippe Detmold house order 2nd class with swords at the ring
- Lippe Detmold Leopold-order 2nd class

Unfortunately I don´t have more information or a photo of Oldwig-Albrecht von Natzmer...maybe someone can add something, which might be interesting?

Best regards
Roman
 

[Stogieman]

Beautiful bar!

[David M]

Did you try the family (if they are still around?)

[Glenn J]

Roman,

his biography from the Offizier-Stammliste of 1. GRzF plus his portrait.

Regards

Glenn

[Solomon]

Wow, thank you for the picture...I count at least four enameled Lippe-awards :-)

Edited October 29, 2016 by Solomon

[Deutschritter]

Very interesting! Do you think he might have also gotten the EK I? His father was the Generalleutnant Oldwig Wilhelm Ferdinand von Natzmer (1842–1899), his grandfather (from his mother's side) was the Generalleutnant Adolf Albrecht von Natzmer (1801–1884). Solomon, here my small list, please let me know, if I got everything:

 

Zentenarmedaille, 1897

Schaumburg-Lippisches Ehrenkreuz, Ehrenkreuz IV. Klasse (SLH4)

Fürstlich Lippischer Hausorden, Ehrenkreuz IV. Klasse 1. Abteilung (LDH4/LH4)

Albrechts-Orden, Ritter II. Klasse (SA3b)

Königlich Norwegischer Orden des heiligen Olaf, Ritterkreuz II. Klasse (NO3b)

Militärverdienstorden (Bayern), IV. Klasse (BMV4)

Herzoglich Sachsen-Ernestinischer Hausorden, Ritterkreuz I. Klasse (HSH3a)

Albrechts-Orden, Ritterkreuz I. Klasse (SA3a)

Roter Adlerorden, IV. Klasse

Fürstlich Schaumburg-Lippischer Hausorden, Ehrenkreuz III. Klasse (SLH3)

Fürstlich Lippischer Hausorden, Offizier-Ehrenkreuz (LDH.O)

Orden Heinrichs des Löwen, Ritterkreuz I. Klasse (BrH3a) am 7. März 1913

Greifenorden, Ritterkreuz mit der Krone (MG3mKr)

Krone zum Albrechts-Orden Ritterkreuz I. Klasse (SA3a.mKr)

Leopold-Orden (Lippe), II. Klasse

Eisernes Kreuz (1914), II. Klasse

Kriegsverdienstkreuz (Lippe)

Schwerter zum Fürstlich Lippischen Hausorden Offizier-Ehrenkreuz (LDH.O⚔) am 17. Februar 1917

Kriegervereinskreuz Lippe-Detmold

Lippischer Hausorden, Ehrenkreuz II. Klasse mit Schwertern am Ringe (LDH2⚔a.R) am 30. Mai 1918

Preußisches Dienstauszeichnungskreuz (probably 1917)

Edited November 18, 2021 by Deutschritter

[Solomon]

Haha, good question...I checked his receipt for the Lippe-Detmold house order 2ns class with swords at the ring,

which he awarded on 30th May 1918....Oldwig von Natzmer was a quite lazy guy and listed under "other awards"

just these three (quite strange) awards:

-Kriegsverdienstkreuz

-LD HO X (Lippe-Detmold house order with swords ???. class)

-Kriegsverdienstkreuz (which one???)

 

I also have another picture of him (see screenshot), but on the picture there is no award visible.

 

I´m quite sure, von Natzmer received am EK 1st class, but I have no proof for it.

 

Aaaah, the entry LD HO X must be Lippe-Detmold officer´s cross with swords, which he received on 17th Febraury 1917.

A look on his receipt for the officer´s cross with swords didn´t provide any additional information.

Von Natzmer was quite lazy to list all of his awards...he just listed:

 

- EK 2 = iron cross 2nd class

- Fürstl. Lippisches Kriegsverdienstkreuz

- R.A. 4 = red eagle order 4th class

- Fürstl. Lipp. Kriegsverdienstkreuz (???)

- u.v.m ( = and many more)

[Deutschritter]

I have added:

 

Kriegsverdienstkreuz (Lippe)

Schwerter zum Fürstlich Lippischen Hausorden Offizier-Ehrenkreuz (LDH.O⚔) am 17. Februar 1917

Lippischer Hausorden, Ehrenkreuz II. Klasse mit Schwertern am Ringe (LDH2⚔a.R) am 30. Mai 1918

 

Are we keeping the Kriegervereinskreuz Lippe-Detmold? Thanks!

[Solomon]

Yes, he got the Kriegervereinskreuz on 30th May 1916 as No. 196 of the rolls.

On this receipt he was more engaged and listed all awards he received so far.

 

Butt it seems that at least until 1916 he didn´t receive the iron cross 1st class...

Edited November 18, 2021 by Solomon

[David M]

On 18/11/2021 at 13:42, Solomon said:

Haha, good question...I checked his receipt for the Lippe-Detmold house order 2ns class with swords at the ring,

which he awarded on 30th May 1918....Oldwig von Natzmer was a quite lazy guy and listed under "other awards"

just these three (quite strange) awards:

-Kriegsverdienstkreuz

-LD HO X (Lippe-Detmold house order with swords ???. class)

-Kriegsverdienstkreuz (which one???)

 

I also have another picture of him (see screenshot), but on the picture there is no award visible.

 

I´m quite sure, von Natzmer received am EK 1st class, but I have no proof for it.

 

Aaaah, the entry LD HO X must be Lippe-Detmold officer´s cross with swords, which he received on 17th Febraury 1917.

A look on his receipt for the officer´s cross with swords didn´t provide any additional information.

Von Natzmer was quite lazy to list all of his awards...he just listed:

 

- EK 2 = iron cross 2nd class

- Fürstl. Lippisches Kriegsverdienstkreuz

- R.A. 4 = red eagle order 4th class

- Fürstl. Lipp. Kriegsverdienstkreuz (???)

- u.v.m ( = and many more)

Shouldnt that be u.s.w. statt u.v.m.?

[Solomon]

Correct, mea culpa...he wrote u.s.w. ...but at the end the message is the same ?

[David M]

Oh it was just checking my own reading abilities

[VtwinVince]

Apparently there was a Luftwaffe general with this name. Can't find much info on him.

[Dave Danner]

Oldwig Otto Wilhelm Gneomar v. Natzmer (1904-1980) was a Heer Generalleutnant. I don't know of a Luftwaffe general. DeZeng and Stankey have a Luftwaffe Oberst Gneomar v. Natzmer in their Luftwaffe officer list, but I don't know which Gneomar he was.

[VtwinVince]

Thanks Dave, that must be the guy.

[Solomon]

13 hours ago, Dave Danner said:

Oldwig Otto Wilhelm Gneomar v. Natzmer (1904-1980) was a Heer Generalleutnant. I don't know of a Luftwaffe general. DeZeng and Stankey have a Luftwaffe Oberst Gneomar v. Natzmer in their Luftwaffe officer list, but I don't know which Gneomar he was.

 

Hi Dave,
according to the name, this should be the son of the Flügeladjudant Lippe-Detmold Oldwig von Natzmer.

BR
Roman

[Dave Danner]

1 hour ago, Solomon said:

 

Hi Dave,
according to the name, this should be the son of the Flügeladjudant Lippe-Detmold Oldwig von Natzmer.

BR
Roman

Roman,

 

Oldwig-Otto was the son of Wilhelm Oldwig Wolff Heinrich (1871-1927), who was a general staff officer and a Generalmajor in the Reichswehr. They were from the I. Linie, 2. Ast, 1. Zweig, 2. Haus.

 

Oldwig-Albrecht was from the 3. Haus of the same line. He did not get married until 1922, and he was 48 while his wife was 40, so he probably had no children. He had three sisters.

 

Oldwig-Otto was Oldwig-Albrecht's 3rd cousin, once removed. Their common ancestor was Oberst Wulf Heinrich v. Natzmer (1735-1787), Kommandant von Kolberg and Stammvater of the 1. Zweig:

 

2. Haus
 - Ernst (1776-1810), Rittergutsbesitzer, Kgl. preuß. Lt.a.D.
 -- Wilhelm (1803-1852), Rittergutsbesitzer, Kgl. preuß. Hptm.a.D.
 --- Oldwig (1841-1916),Kgl. preuß. Oberstleutnant a.D.
 ---- Wilhelm (1871-1927), Generalmajor der Reichswehr
 ----- Oldwig-Otto (1904-1980), Generalleutnant der Wehrmacht

 

3. Haus
 - Felix Ferdinand (1870-1815), Kgl. preuß. Oberstleutnant
 -- Ferdinand (1815-1868), Kgl. preuß. Generalmajor
 --- Oldwig (1842-1899), Kgl. preuß. Generaleutnant z.D.
 ---- Oldwig-Albrecht (1874-1927), Kgl. preuß. Oberstleutnant a.D., Flügeladjutant

 

Oldwig-Albrecht's great-grandfather Felix Ferdinand died of wounds received at the Battle of Ligny with the 26. Infanterie-Regiment. His grandfather, Ferdinand, was commander of the 24. Infanterie-Brigade at the time of his death.

 

 

[Deutschritter]

Dave, once again, you have given us information, without even knowing it. So Oldwig Albrecht Adolf Ferdinand von Natzmer was Oberstleutnant, not just Major (6 June 1916)? Did he receive the promotion upon retiring 31 March 1920? He married 1922? Do you happen to know who? Maybe a widow? Sadly it was a short marriage. Thank you!

 

He had an older sister (Stiftsdame von Geseke-Keppel) and two younger ones. His maternal grandfather (I. Linie, 2. Ast, 1. Zweig, 2. Haus) was Generalleutnant z. D. Adolf Albrecht von Natzmer (1801–1884)?! 

Edited December 6, 2021 by Deutschritter

[Deutschritter]

On 04/12/2021 at 18:19, VtwinVince said:

Apparently there was a Luftwaffe general with this name. Can't find much info on him.

The Luftwaffe-Oberst (der Reserve?), who had also served as an officer in WW I (Garde-Jäger-Bataillon?), was Kammerjunker and Ehrenritter des Johanniterordens Gneomar von Natzmer (1883–1968), Herr auf Trebendorf, Gahry und Jocksdorf, son of Ritterschaftsrat Gneomar (1852–1913). The Oberst's son also served in WW II (probably army): Oberleutnant Gneomar von Natzmer-Gahry. 

[Dave Danner]

Oldwig-Albrecht was married to Therese Sophie Liese (16.6.1882-21.10.1949) on 18.2.1922 in Dortmund. It was also apparently her first marriage. His older sister, the Stiftsdame, was Elise Anna Klara Karoline Erna (17.8.1872-12.6.1957). His middle sister was Elise Margarete Sophie Irmgard (14.5.1877-4.11.1919). Her death certificate listed her as unmarried and "ohne Beruf". His youngest sister, Therese Anna Gabriele Meta (15.6.1881-25.5.1943), was married on 8.11.1911 to Ferdinand-Levin Freiherr v. Wintzingerode (16.9.1881-1.7.1958), Landgräflich hessicher Hofchef and Kammerdirektor. He was a Hptm.d.L. in IR 66.

 

Gen.Lt.z.D. Adolf Albrecht v. Natzmer was the older brother of Wilhelm Friedrich Wulf v. Natzmer (1803-1852), Oldwig-Otto's grandfather. So Oldwig-Otto and Oldwig-Albrecht were also cousins that way.

 

Oberst Gneomar Ferdinand Peter Albertus v. Natzmer was Oldwig-Albrecht's first cousin. He was an OLt.d.R. in the Garde-Jäger-Bataillon and Hptm.d.R.a.D. He was named a Kammerjunker in 1911.

 

Edited December 7, 2021 by Dave Danner

[VtwinVince]

Thanks Deutschritter, that clears things up. Very interesting geneology in this family.

[Deutschritter]

9 minutes ago, Dave Danner said:

Oldwig-Albrecht was married to Therese Sophie Liese (16.6.1882-21.10.1949) on 18.2.1922 in Dortmund. It was also apparently her first marriage. His older sister, the Stiftsdame, was Elise Anna Klara Karoline Erna (17.8.1872-12.6.1957). His middle sister was Elise Margarete Sophie Irmgard (14.5.1877-4.11.1919). Her death certificate listed her as unmarried and "ohne Beruf". His youngest sister, Therese Anna Gabriele Meta (15.6.1881-25.5.1943), was married on 8.11.1911 to Ferdinand-Levin Freiherr v. Wintzingerode (16.9.1881-1.7.1958), Landgräflich hessicher Hofchef and Kammerdirektor. He was a Hptm.d.L. in IR 66.

 

Gen.Lt.z.D. Adolf Albrecht v. Natzmer was the older brother of Wilhelm Friedrich Wulf v. Natzmer (1803-1852), Oldwig-Otto's grandfather. So Oldwig-Otto and Oldwig-Albrecht were also cousins that way.

 

Oberst Gneomar Ferdinand Peter Albertus v. Natzmer was Oldwig-Albrecht's first cousin. He was an OLt.d.R. in the Garde-Jäger-Bataillon and Hptm.d.R.a.D. He was named a Kammerjunker in 1911.

 

Phantastic, Dave, thank you!