EK 1870 - any chances it is original?

[Marcin L]

Dear Colleagues,

 

would you please check the below pictures of the reverse of EK 1870 and try to tell whether there is any chance it is original?

 

I would appreciate it much.

 

 

[ashley58]

Hi,

really need a picture of the obverse .... not to happy with what i see here ! but there are others more experienced than myself ......... 

though not an entire shot but here is my reverse with markings ...

 

[VtwinVince]

Not genuine.

[BlackcowboyBS]

I wouldn't want to have it, this might tell you enough.

[Marcin L]

Thank you, I of course followed your comments / advice.

[Peter Cornwell]

Not good but I've seen far worse. A photo of the obverse would have been useful if only to see what sort of job they made of that. IMO walk away.

[Graf]

Not Original, yes i have seen worse copies

[v.Perlet]

On 08/11/2021 at 01:49, Marcin L said:

Dear Colleagues,

 

would you please check the below pictures of the reverse of EK 1870 and try to tell whether there is any chance it is original?

 

I would appreciate it much.

 

 

Hello,

I have the feeling that you guys are/were discussing about two different EKI's,

The one Marcin L posted is supposedly a 1870 cross - but with no front picture attached.

 

The one ashley 58 posted is an EKI of unknown date - but the markings etc. don't convince me.

Marcin L would still have to post a front photo - in order to determine it.- eve though the stamp isn't convincing either.

I however agree with Peter Cornwells statement.

So to which cross are the other 4 and their comments referring to?

Or did I get something wrong here?

 

Regards

v.Perlet

Edited January 28, 2022 by v.Perlet

[Graf]

Those marks are only on 1870 Crosses

All opinions are regarding the MarcinL post

Yes it will be nice if you have  pictures of the front of the cross, although the picture of the reverse is convincing enough that this 1870 cross is not good or highly questionable

[saschaw]

9 hours ago, v.Perlet said:

Or did I get something wrong here?

Seems to be! All negative comments referred to the thread starter, the cross posted by Marcin L, which is not an authentic one. Seeing the front side is not needed to be definitive, and it would certainly be no pleasure anyway. This is probably some ugly and rather recent full fake of an 1870 1st class cross!

 

On the other hand, ashley58's cross, as far as can be told from one small picture of the reverse, seems to be a textbook award type. Everything that I can see is how it's supposed to be. I'm not sure what doesn't "convince" you about it, but do wonder what references you're using on 1870 crosses...

 

Authentic pieces being talked to death by not too experienced collectors certainly is a problem on some forums, and one of my worst nightmares. In the past years, I tried to give my opinion only when I felt confident about it. Please keep in mind any footless comment can cause harm to a collector's finances or to a seller's reputation!

 

 

[VtwinVince]

Quite right, I tend to hold my 'Schnauze' unless I'm fairly confident about my opinion.

[Graf]

Hi  saschaw,

 

You nailed it!  Thanks

 

[v.Perlet]

6 hours ago, saschaw said:

On the other hand, ashley58's cross,........... I'm not sure what doesn't "convince" you about it, but do wonder what references you're using on 1870 crosses...

 

 

Hello saschaw,

 

as you know there are certain technical processes involved in regards to imprinting, punching, stamping or edging of markings.

Ashley58's cross, the marking does not behold the same punching/marking process as of EKI's marked by Wagner that I am aware off. (which doesn't mean that I would know them all) therefore I stated that it doesn't convince me. I NEVER STATED THAT THE EKI, IS OR COULD BE A FAKE

Certainly I would never forward such as statement without seeing the front-view of an EKI 1870 in the first place

Learning and improving upon ones knowledge to me isn't about listening and simply adhering to what someone else might simply state.

But to see evidence towards the statement, and or to have a discussion about different views so as to gain knowledge due to different levels of knowledge or expertise amongst the participants.

 

As you know I am very new to this Forum and it does take some time (at least for me) to analyze certain posters characteristics. There are those who are extremely helpful and cordial and there are those who just pound around their weight and opinions.

 

Below is a photo showing the kind of technical process that I am familiar with, seen on markings done by Wagner

 

Regards

v.Perlet 

Edited January 29, 2022 by v.Perlet