saschaw

I cannot confirm, but Autengruber - Künker's expert for ODM - is one of the greatest connoisseurs of awards, so probably has his reasons and sources... All I can contribute at the moment - in my father's collection, there is a medal bar group with EH3bX with roman swords - awarded by Sachsen-Coburg and Gotha. Fits the theory... Well, if maker X delievered to Coburg and Gotha and maker Y delievered to Altenburg... ;o)

From what I know, not being an expert on Ottoman awards, this is a 4th class insignia due to the gold medaillon - the 5th class' medaillon is in silver.

The usual official issue crosses from 1914, 1915, 1916 are by WS, S-W, G, Fr., FR and so on, which are probably the well-known Berlin jewellers that were the only suppliers for EKs 1st class as long the GOK was responsible.

I hope you didn't buy it? In my eyes, the bar is pure crap. AEZ with reverse to front, a RKK2 without RKM3 which should always be there... and sold by one of my "favorite" eBay sellers.... Just enter his eBay name in the forum search and you'll find his stuff discussed... for years. :shame:

Good ones, but I'm not seeing anything Godet-ish on the first, bigger one? The second one - used to be mine - is by Godet in my humble opinion.

A gold wash on this is never officially. I'm not seeing any here, and that's what they should look like. Don't see anything wrong with this rare medal.

I knew one was awarded them all with, but never seen something like this before... holy cow! Thanks for showing!

Gladly! But there's one thing to add: we're not having real evidence for all of this, but I'm still quite sure it's right what I wrote.... ;o)

I know, I'm late... but I am. http://www.ebay.de/itm/330731515858 If you check the seller's feedback with the auction number, you'll find the buyer. Maybe he wants to part with it? Sometimes it works, I was lucky recently with this...

Agree with Karsten in anything. I tend to like it, but am not sure. If it's a good one, it's a great one!

In Prussia, there was a an agency that was responsible for ordering the state awards, storing them, sending them to the reciepients, and those that had to be returned, had to be sent back there. This was the so called Generalordenskommission ("GOK"). They had examples ("Proben") of the awards, examples that were approved by the king. Any award delievered to them, had to be like this examples. We call this "Probemäßigkeit", the official awarded Prussian awards had to be "probemäßig" - alike the example approved by the king. But not to get me wrong, this was not about a 10th of a milimeter, and it was not about the lengh of a needle or the position of the maker's mark. But a Iron Cross had to have an black, iron core and a silver frame, and the first classes had to be flat, and to be worn on a needle. Anything else - at least as long as the GOK existed - was not officially awarded, but privately purchased: vaulted crosses, screwback crosses, crosses with non-iron core and so on... The awarded crosses in high officers', even generals' and royal's groups are flat. And, by the way, most (or, in my opinion: all) flat award-type crosses from WW1-era are silver, while the vaulted crosses exist in almost any metal we can imagine. Hope this brought some clarity! I'm having to hard job to proove anything I write as much is not even published...

Sounds good. We could not hold it two more years without you... :banger:

Check here: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ritterorden_von_Avis

A RAO2 makes him at least a Generalmajor, which does not fit the grade of the Bavarian MVO... PS: unless the Bavarian is actually a knight's cross 1st class, awarded for China! militaria0815, might it be an old one?!

I'm not having a doubt only flat crosses were awarded. Vaulted crosses were very popular and were bought, but probably some makers offered flat crosses, too. The two crosses shown are probably later bought ones.

Well, it includes some quite rare awards, so I don't think this was too expensive... ;)

:beer:

No idea how you can do it, but feel free to use any text or image you need. Thanks!

The identification work was made by a previous owner, who found him in Baden's "Hof- und Staatshandbuch", 1910 issue. He's still there in 1913. No DOA entry for him. His Redemption order is given as a higher grde, but such mistakes happen, and he's listed as a wearer of Liberia's Lone Star Medal, an older Liberian award that probably got obsolete when the redemption order was introduced. This medal, unfortunately, is missing and replaced by a later, much more common medal. I firstly didn't notice, but the ribbons and the entry match for it... a shame it's missing, but still an interesting and highly unusual group.

To know the end of the story, check my site: http://woeschler-orden.de/deutsches-reich-4er-ordensschnalle-des-konsuls-goedelt-mit-liberia-und-spanien

Believe me, they're hard to find. I'm trying all day long! =P

Offered as remount? Ribbons seem to be new, mounting is, and the medal is worn with the reverse to front. But what should this be?! There is just one big medal of this style, and this is the Prussian Militär-Ehrenzeichen 2. Klasse, which was a silver medal. Not gilt. There were golden (gilt) medals for the Black EMs and NCOs in the colonies, the four classed ("Imperial German", not "Royal Prussian") Kriegerverdienstmedaillen, but those were smaller (2nd class in silver or gold) or had a different design (1st class, again silver and gold, with a portrait of Wilhelm II.). This is none of them. On the latter, there's a great article in "Orden und Ehrenzeichen" vol. 58, which is online available. In German only, unfortunately: http://www.deutsche-...azinuebersicht/

I understand this, very well actually. But that's the actual point: There are very few of these available, while some collectors are willing to spend hard money on it, which results in "ridiculous" prices. That's the law of the market. What someone did spent some years ago - it doesn't affect what's payed today. I'd not buy one myself, as said. But these are the current prices for these, and I'll gladly buy any (nice one) for half or two thirds of it! And would hardly sell for much less than the eBay auction did. ;)

I would neither pay such a price, because I'm not an hardcore EK collector. Just curious, what would you sell yours for? Don't hestitate to offer it to me! =P

Matthew, you mean the Hungarian medal? These had some very different regulations regarding combattant or non-combattant status, so this might match - it does well match the Hindenburg cross with swords! The fire fighters' cross on #8 is from Bundesrepublik era, and a Nazi era award with swastika "should" not be worn with it... but odd things did happen! I'm not sure this isn't good, saw similar ones in wear on 1950s photos.