Ulsterman

A local photo I picked up this summer. Check out the ribbon bar. I have no clue. State Guard? Note, whatever Order/Star he has on his right chest chest though. No shoulder flashes or easy-to-see DIs to ease identification. Its' a "General meets locals to shake hands" photo.

It happened-lots of Kyfserbund guys helped out. Also, civil servants recalled to do war work. I've seen pictures of geriatric forestry officials and wartime postmasters with them.

oops-Jeff, I don't know what happened, but this supposed to tag onto the other thread about the US ribbon bars- sorry. Can it be merged?

Brilliant detective work there chaps-Brilliant!! Best Forum-Ever- :cheers:

hee-hee- As a lawyer, I'm all over questions of intent and enactment of statutes/regulations. U.S. military regulations however, well, my time with the U.S. military stretches directly and indirectly from 1960 to today and as you know, nothing is sometimes more dangerous to military efficiency than regulations. Let me tell you about the (brief) time back in 1971 when all AAFES/ Europe boxed mail was sent via the Spanish postal system! or how I once went TDY and ended up in Iceland for a fun-filled two weeks instead of landing at McGuire AFB (because transfer flight orders were required for each flight taken-so if one gets off to buy a souvenir at Reykjavik during refueling, suddenly you need "new" travel orders! Also, as someone whose personal home number was once accidentally listed as the NORAD/Europe liaison/question number.....for three years (!)..... despite reams of mimeographs being filled out and submitted.... I note that Bender's book also includes an interpretation of a 12 month service requirement. Personally, had I been a units' clerk/officer, I'd have read it your way Doc and Col. McC., but it's an interesting question and I'd like to see service records either way. Like I said, I know a bunch of guys who have this medal, but they were all in in 1940. The navy requirement for the ribbon was ONLY 10 days service, which further argues that the army must've clarified further at some point. In 1941 there were what, an additional @130,000 troops called up before Pearl?

May we see a close up of the unit stamp please?

Jeepers, how many "old party comrades" can there have been left in 1968 +? Makes you wonder if he was given it as a long service award for adhering to the party through the long and dangerous years.

Hmmmm... what is really interesting is that many of the 17th ID got additional bars for operations (Orleans, Le Mans etc.). The Loigny-Poupry clasp is rarish: Mecklenb.-Dragoner Regt. 17/18 or.. a big wound? He may, with luck and MUCH effort , be findable, as Glenns' 1870 EK2 list would narrow the search. Then through a process of exclusion ( prior to 1917 death, additional medals, 1866 service etc. etc.. ) A retired Major's bar?

Hmmm.... I never read this as pertaining to length of contacted enlistment, but I could well be wrong in my interpretation. Everyone I know who actually got one of these was in the military well before 1941, so my own experience has clouded my perception. The Officers' Guide, 8th edition (p. 162-63), perhaps the most useful and influential US military book out there as it was used by thousands of newly minted officers in the war, states: "The American Defense Service Ribbon is authorized to military personnel for honorable service by those who entered upon a period of active federal service for 12 months or longer AND who in the discharge of such service served at any time between September 8, 1939 and December 7, 1941. Pending the issue of these medals, eligible persons may purchase and wear the American Defense service ribbon. (Circular 104: April 9, 1942). This infers actual 12 months service I think. I'd be interested what some of the expert US collectors think/know. Was there a clarifying War Dept. addendum? As an aside, in the Officer's guide of 1943 I find the following interesting statement: "Personnel who have NOT served outside the CONUS are EXCLUDED from wearing the American theater ribbon by the provisions of the Executive Order." So, unless you went outside the US, at least during the war, you got zip. Given the number of photos I have seen with the American theater ribbon being worn by officers at training camps inside the USA, I'm willing to bet that was changed by 1945.

A few things: 1. I believe some Berlin vets have an UNOFFICIAL (but nice) Berlin bar they attach to their occupation medal. 2. Anyone stationed in the Gulf Region during Gulf War One I thought was eligible for the campaign medal AND the Kuwaiti victory medal. I have a good friend, a marine Col., who never actually left the ship 50 miles south of Bahrain and still received one. 3. If by some bizarre reason you Dad wasn't entitled to the Gulf War One medal (and frankly, I'd be amazed if he wasn't entitled, I know people stationed in Ramstein who still got it: see air flight reasins 1 and 3 below..."direct support of operations"), then I'm 99% certain that overseas deployment in that area AFTER August, 1990 earned him an Armed Forces Expeditionary medal. 4. Although the "Cold War Victory Medal" is only a certificate at this time, it is still a Congressionally authorized "award". One day Congress will authorize issue of such a medal-probably as a 50 year commemorative,and like the old Wiemar era veteran's medals, it would add panache to the grouping. Personally, I hope you engrave and mount them too. 100 years they will still be here and treasured by someone and your Dad's memory will still be around because of them. Do you have a photo of him for the box too? The swiftest and most effective way sometimes to get these medals due is to write to your Senator, enclosing his paperwork and request a medal review. Senatorial requests at the Pentagon get higher priority than Congressional ones and Senators often have someone like me on staff who was done a score or more of these requests and can expedite the medal review. Jeff Floyd may also be able to help you-and the Legion/VFW also has people who can and do help with owed medals.

You mean the 1813 EK bar Ed? That is a beauty.

very cool! wonderful to have a nice piece that has a direct link with a man long gone.

very cool Paul-and it dates the straps too!

True-maddening so for poor Arnold and his rag-tag army slogging northward through the snows of the Kennebec vally. Ever get a chance to read any of Kenneth Roberts? Perhaps if my stiff necked Congregationalist New England ancestors had not sacked Louisberg so thoroughly and despised Catholics so virulently.... they were the grandchildren of the Puritans after all. Even today the massive silver Catholic altarpiece from Louisberg is in the Portland Museum of art-a testimony to anti-Catholic sentiment and an early bit of war booty.

Guys, He did not get the EK2 because that wasn't authorized until 5.8.1914 and even then it was awarded in Namibia to German forces/veterans as a cloth award until the real ones were handed out in the 1920/21 winter. Gordon MacGregors' book by the way is excellent on this subject, but his translation of the original statute of the 1914 EK raises and explains) a few issues. (It is laced with detailed footnotes and an award roster, something I am glad to see in a medal book). I suspect Ironside received either the AEZ or the merit medal on black/white ribbon. His career is VERY well established and so is this story. He was not the sort of man to make up this sort of thing. Indeed, he was so accomplished- a legend in his own lifetime- that he downplayed his career exploits. Write to King's College in London and they'll give you the details. They are VERY helpful. Heck, they might even have his original award certificate.

Bavarian Red Cross?

May we see more? Apparently he ended up in a field hospital in the summer of 1915 (I think).

The 1/3 Tory, 1/3 Revolutionary and 1/3 neutral is actually based on some serious scholarship. It changed dramatically depending upon local too: New England was certainly more radical before 1776 than the rest of the colonies. The six percent is based upon the numbers in Ulster. It infers a civil government not willing to take Cromwellian measures to suppress an insurrection. If the government takes the "Pinochet option", you'd need a LOT more. General Sir Frank Kitson lectured on this " terror statistic" in the 1980s. As an aside, my Patroon ancestors came to new York in the 1640s. My Great-Grandmother still spoke "aldtey Duutch" as a first language-and she was born in 1870.

yup-Hougemont. The woods-if there are any left would be directly abutting the buildings to the sothward side.

..."would you like to see my medals"? My cousin and I were at the local medal show last week and this popped up. I have zero Russian language skills, but couldn't say no to this unusual tid-bit, especially as I trust my cousin's instincts. I would welcome any comments and commentary. Seems like the medal was hard-won. I wonder how many of his class survived the war.

Ironically however, "The vein openers" refers to the Boston Massacre. The regiment still guards against imminent Micmac Indian attack with its special sword during officers' mess special dinners.

The Chataeu, esp. the orchard's remains on the lower right of the British line-bottom of the (now much flatter ) ridge/troop line. There's a thread in the Napoleonic subforum that shows several medals earned in those small, very bloody areas of battle ground.

This is very exciting!! Welcome Sudanese!! Did the tribe offer allied auxiliary warriors to the Khedives'/British forces against the Mahdi?

But there are Administrative lists out there....there's always hope....albeit little. :Cat-Scratch: