Bundeswehr Museum in Dresden

[Claudio]

Dear forumites,

I just wanted to show some nice Imperial items, especially medal groups and medal bars, shown in the temparary exihibition of the Bundeswehr Museum in Dresden. Very nice museum with very interesting pieces of history. Lots of Saxon stuff. Definetely worth a visit; also the city of Dresden is, IMHO, really beautiful with its Baroc buildings and newly rebuilt Frauenkirche.

Here the first group which impressed me very much... Generalmajor Ralph von Egidy's medals!

[Claudio]

Ribbon bar and first (upper) part of Egidy's medal bar

[Claudio]

Biographical information on Genmaj von Egidy...

[Claudio]

Max Immelmann!!!! :speechless1:

[Claudio]

Close up of Max Immelmann's orders and medals.

[Claudio]

Paradeuniform of a Prussian General in all its splendor!

[Claudio]

Another beautiful Imperial medal bar with a colonial medal and its rare "Gefechtsspangen".... :speechless1:

[Claudio]

...and of course the last shown medal bar came with a name and the biographical info of the recipient!!! :speechless1:

[Claudio]

another beautiful medal bar with its little brother ribbon bar... :speechless:

Edited April 18, 2009 by Claudio

[Paul C]

Very nice and thanks for posting it.

[Guest Rick Research]

Ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.

The medal bar on the Prussian General's tunic belonged to GenMaj aD G. F. L. von Kloeden (1849-1929).

:cheers:

[jaba1914]

THe bar and PLM of Immelmann is only a reproduction not the real bar. The tunic is also not his. I don't know if the EK and CM belong to Immelmann.

Regards Alex

[Deruelle]

Nice Claudio,

IN the post n? 9 , the bar and ribbon bar belonged to Oberst Gruson ? If so, it is interresting to see commander crosses shows in the ribbon bar.

Christophe

[Claudio]

@ Rick: thanks for your additional info....

@ Christophe: I can't remember the name of the recipient of no. 9 medal bar, but you might be correct.

@ Alex: I thought the same about Immelmann's medal bar; it's clearly not the one is wearing on the photo.

Claudio

[Wild Card]

Hello Claudio,

It has been a while since I last visited beautiful Dresden and this wonderful museum - thank you for the pictures.

If I am not mistaken, I think that it is worth mentioning that it appears that Generalmajor von Egidy?s St. Henry

knight?s badge is about one hundred years older than the other medals on the bar.

I just got back from Kirchheim last night. Lots of good stuff there.

Best wishes and Happy Hunting,

Wild Card

[Claudio]

@ Wild Card: Yes, you're right... I also noticed it right away... these Napoleonic era St. Heinrich Crosses are rare as hen's teeth... Thies has one in a named bar on his upcoming auction (see below)... Too bad the starting price is so high...

Best luck to you, too! ;-)

Ciao,

Claudio

Edited April 22, 2009 by Claudio

[Stogieman]

My good friend Wildcard has a most accurate eye... that is indeed a very special St. Henry RK

[Claudius]

@ Wild Card: Yes, you're right... I also noticed it right away... these Napoleonic era St. Heinrich Crosses are rare as hen's teeth... Thies has one in a named bar on his upcoming auction (see below)... Too bad the starting price is so high...

Best luck to you, too! ;-)

Ciao,

Claudio

Don't forget the buyer's premium....more like 9800E. So don't worry, I won't be bidding against you.

Last time I was in Dresden, I had a backpack on my back and the Frauenkirche was still mostly a pile of rocks, but the Zwinger was underway. How is the terrace now days?

[Claudio]

Hi Claudius,

The Frauenkirche is beautiful and stands out in all its Barock splendor... however it's just a copy... It's just incredible to see how much has been destroyed during the very last months or days of WWII, when the war was virtually already won by the allied forces by January-February 2009 (the Garnisonkirche in Potsdam was heavily hit just 2 weeks before war's end, as an example). What a tragedy for Germany to go through two completely avoidable world wars... and what a waste!

Much of the old splendor is gone... luckily now there is a revival of interest in re-building magnificent buildings of the past, like the Stadtschloss in Berlin. There is also a project to completely or at least partly re-build the Garnisonkirche in Potsdam (however I doubt very much that they will be able to put the money together and re-build something that was the very heart of Prussian militarism that in the end of WWII tried so hard to get rid of Hitler). It's really a shame when you see the Potsdamer Platz in Berlin, although it looks so futuristique and modern, the old spirit and charme has gone forever... Two world wars have dramatically changed the very soul of German people and its way the see the their past... I was very emotional and very sad when I stood before the Frauenkirche and I thought about the carpet bombing of February 1945 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombing_of_Dresden_in_World_War_II). I was also in N?rnberg... when I think that this old town was 90% destroyed and what you see today has been mostly re-build completely, you get the picture how hard Germans worked in late 40's and early 50's... But what you see it's just a copy of what it has been before... very sad, indeed!

My 2 cents.

Claudio

[Claudius]

Hello Claudio;

Yes, I agree it is sad when the charm of the old buildings is lost. It makes one appreciate what remains even more. Thank you for the photo. It looks like it was a beautiful day when you took it. I hope I can visit the city again. I understand the interest to rebuild these old buildings had accelerated since Re-Unification. I was in Berlin when there was a fa?ade of the Stadtschloss for display. I would love to see what they have done since in the former East Berlin area.

It is painful to see how much was lost. The destruction of war, the lives lost and torn apart is appalling. It is because of it that my own wife can't quite understand my collecting interest. Even after explaining, it seems to her to be at best, a morbid fascination or at worst, latent jingoism.

By birth I am a child of the Allied forces. When I travel abroad I am frequently called upon to account for my country?s actions in past conflicts. I'm asked, What did they teach me in elementary school about these wars and the people America fought against? I?m fine with the questions. I?m always glad to answer them the best I can. Most are surprised that we don't consider our victorious wars as glorious, or our generals as heroes. Instead, the ordinary soldier is honored on Veteran?s Day as someone that does his duty for his country.

With the advent of Total War in the 20th century, the Pandora?s Box of horrors can seldom be held back. For our own past, America learned much about this progression during our own 1861-65 Civil War. A war, that taught many things. Not the least of these was, once it was unavoidable if the war would have been prosecuted earlier without ineptitude it would not have lasted four years and ultimately hundreds of thousands of lives. When an end could finally be grasped, it was only through harsh generals and harsher methods. Even today, there are those that can absolve the ?The War of Northern Aggression?(aka US Civil War), but they can?t forgive General William Tecumseh Sherman?s ?March to the Sea? and his burning of Atlanta, Georgia. His war philosophy, and I quote. ?War is the remedy that our enemies have chosen, and I say let us give them all they want.?

Was it necessary to drop two atomic bombs on Japan? Did Hamburg have to be fire bombed? Was it necessary to use these weapons to stop this conflict? The Allies' opponents had already shown us; Pearl Harbor, the Rape of Nanking, London Terror bombing, and the genocide of Europe?s outcasts. These too were terrible events. What panacea would be considered too strong to end this war sooner? In WWII when the great governments fought, each with their hands around the other?s throat, trying to throttle the other, could the Allies have loosened their grip just as the Axis were failing?

Of all the superlatives that come out during a war, ?self-restraint? is not among them. It is another reason why war should be avoided. Not in fear of what your enemy will do to you, but because in fear of what YOU (myself) will do to another human being. It is a brutalism that has to be retarded if there is to be a hope of being considered an enlightened culture.

Kind Regards,

Claudius

Edited April 24, 2009 by Claudius

[Chris Boonzaier]

Is this the new museum? The one where they cut the building in half?

Best

Chris

[Dave Danner]

You mean this gash?

[Dave Danner]

The building where the new museum is located served as the Artillerie-Depot for the Royal Saxon Army. It was part of the Arsenal compex, a group of buildings that made one cluster of the giant collection of casernes in the Albertstadt. Facing the Artillerie-Depot were buildings which served the XII.Armeekorps headquarters and support staffs, and which are still used by the Bundeswehr. Elsewhere in the Albertstadt, the Kadettenhaus and main Kaserne building of IR 177 serve the Bundeswehr's Offizierschule des Heeres, though other garrison buildings are long gone and replaced by a modern builidng. Most other remaining casernes in the Alberstadt are unused or in private hands. When I drove by there in September 2012, about the only remaining part of the Leib-Grenadier-Kaserne was being renovated and sold as loft apartments. The neighboring Kaiser-Grenadier-Kaserne for GR 101, which survived WW2 mostly intact and was headquarters of the 1st Guards Tank Army until the Soviets left, is apparently used by offices of the government of Freistaat Sachsen.

For what it is worth, I do not remember seeing almost all of the uniforms and medal bars which Claudio showed. Much of the museum's current display seems to be weapons and gear, along with various odd displays less about military history and more about cultural impacts like war movies and the influence of military terminology on language. I like my military museums jam-packed with military stuff, so that you leave wishing you had more time and wanting to come back, but this museum has lots of empty space. In that respect, it does not really compare with the National Army Museum in Chelsea or the Musée de l'Armée in Paris, though it is similar to the Imperial War Museum and many American museums.

Some random pics:

Helmut Lent's Oakleaves, Swords and Diamonds:

Oskar Boddien's Knight's Cross with Oakleaves:

A patriotic blanket made up of enlisted shoulder boards from different regiments:

Medal bar of Hans Oster, Abwehr officer and resistance leader:

Medal bar of Franz Xaver Heller, a Baden enlisted veteran of Southwest Africa and WW1, displayed on his uniform as a member of the Reichskolonialbund:

Edited February 7, 2013 by Dave Danner

[Claudio]

^{Thanks Dave, for your in-depth report... now I am not sure to make an extra trip to Dresden to see this museum again... Why the museums curators do so? To hold on their jobs in fear to show something "too daringly militarist"??? How many interesting medal groups and medal bars are probably archived and will never see the day's light? That's really frustrating... Of course just for the sake of political correctness!!!!}

^ciao,

^Claudio

Edited February 8, 2013 by Claudio

[Chris Boonzaier]

I think it is the "modern" way of doing museums....

Lots of open space, panels explaing ghistory, and just a hint of old stuff....