Claudius

Greetings all; I've been caring around for some time a semi-understanding of spangenstück medals but I was hoping someone or multiple someone’s could define and opine on spangenstück medals. Starting with the basic; What is spangenstück, but moving to the more interesting; Why did they use spangenstück? How many medals had a spangenstück version available. Why did they use them instead of the original issue medal? Was it because; 1) They lost the government issue? 2) They were keeping it safe at home and only wanted to put a period-copy on their medal bar? 3) Recipients thought the spangenstück looked nicer than the government copy. 4) None of the above, or 5) All of the above. If there is a specific, or multiple reason, does anyone know of great examples of a recipient consciously using a spangenstück and giving their reason. Period correspondence, literature or advertising for spangenstück. Thank you in advance.

Or could be used by re-enactors, or as an example in a museum display, or as an inexpensive collecting alternative. If you do keep it, or pass it on, I would suggest irreversibly marking the piece so that it can never be interpreted as a period badge. "counterfeit" carved into the reverse comes to mind. Just a thought. (This issue is near the surface to me because soon I will be interested in buying a recognized fake award as a place holder. But that's going to be a different thread altogether)

no, no, no...My remark in not meant to be disparaging in any way. When I was appreciating it I had not even given it a thought that there were no enamel awards. I only just now realized there were no enamels. It was only an observation. As I said, statistically it is interesting that there is no enamel award, but the kind of the awards that are present, as well as all belonging to an identifiable person is laudable.

Thank you Claudio. Not even a single enamel...and it went for 9.600E. Perhaps the most ever paid for a German medal bar without any enamel awards? Yes or No? An interesting statistic if true. Thoughts?

Yes, quite correct. And I think the buyer premium is 20%. If so, that would mean the winner paid 9,600E.

Just not enough of these around to keep a current idea of value. I remember seeing one for sale over 10 years ago; I don't know what it finally sold for. Do you want to know value for curiosity sake, or are you looking to sell it?

You are a bold gentleman Misiu. Your notification of the auktion is very chivalrous and somewhat challenging on your part. Others may keep their own council as to their plans, but I will at least say for myself that I will not bid against you for this outstanding medal bar. Good Luck. PS: If (when) you win the bar please provide some close-up photos. I think that we all would like to get a good look at this one. Thank you.

Let's hope that when you spend 700GBP on a bar you're not going to ruin the value. To sell the medal individually? What other purpose would there be in removing the medal&ribbon? Is this some kind of numismatic equivalent of ethnic-cleansing? Please tell me it's not. :violent:

I have never even SEEN one before. Can anyone tell me what it is? What is it for? and any other details. It looks really interesting....

Outstanding work Rick. Congratulations on the fruits of your efforts.

Well, that doesn't seem too bad. Just let me convert your AU to my currency and....OH MY GOD! He is asking a lot. He's not selling medals, he's displaying his collection with an offer to anyone that wants it. At that price you might tease my loose Hamburg from me. DSWA non-combattant on a WWI combattant bar. It just might be all about what capacity the gent was acting in when in the kolonial forces. Someone who knows a lot more about the history of DSWA might be able to say if this was likely. On a different level, I don't why someone would WANT to swap out the combattant DSWA for a non-combattant. What is there to gain for the trouble.

Pray tell, what was on the bar? Overall you are justified in not paying outrageous prices for items. I don't need to tell you about ebray and how a seller will post an EK2 as the rarest medal on earth. But just curious what your local dealer had that he thinks is so valuable.

There is no real need to put another shovel of dirt on this one, but here goes... bit of a crazy quilt of ribbons too. Especially those Hanseatic ribbons in middle. Is it Bremen or Hamburg or both.

Getting more and more interesting. Claudio, please keep us abreast of developments as prudence would allow.

Inspector Javert?....nah, I think of Rick more as a Sandman from Logan's Run. Congratulations Rick. It's great that you could catch this "Runner".

Hello JK and, on behalf myself, welcome to the GMIC website. I hope you visit often, post photos, questions and your insights. I don't think your question is stupid. In fact my answer will likely not be universally agreed upon by others. But here is my attempt. No, a dealer or website doesn't offer much in proof of authenticity other than a 100% money back guarantee. The good dealers will provide a money back guarantee and therefore it is a good idea to keep good records and the receipt of purchase. A dealer in good standing, and with a long history will also be an expert in the field and will generally only offer legitimate items for sale. It is only if the collector loses confidence in the piece or it because recognized as false that the money back option is needed. One dealer would provide a documents with the description of the item, a photo along with a date and purchase amount as a form of a guarantee. These became so recognized as a seal of authenticity that forged items would have forged Detlev documents! The best hope (for all of us) is learn everything you can about a legitimate items construction, known dimensions, maker marks, etc as well as the traits of known fakes. Then you can purchase with greater confidence from good dealers that will know the items they sell and offer refunds. Ask stupid questions. Dealers love to discuss the items and everything they can about them. It's is best way to get the most enjoyment out of this hobby. Regards, Claudius

that made me laugh. Sorry Claudio. It is probably not enjoyable to see others use photos of your collection to commit crimes.

That's great that you found the photo of ribbon bar and mini-chain. While it is possible that a faker put together both, at this point I would say res ipsa loquitur. An uncommon combination. I hope the identity can be discerned.

Is there a suspension hook on the back? I seem to recall that when the award was for a TWM on a ribbon bar there was no hook in back. Can anyone show their example of this?

You might be thinking a young Richard Attenborough (think of the movie, The Sand Pebbles w/Steve McQueen). Some English and German bloodlines do have common ancestors. I was noticing the two scars across his forehead. Unless that is a fault of the photo. Perhaps that how he earned his award.