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Everything posted by Schießplatzmeister
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Hello: Well, maybe the medal rings should be placed under the ribbons, and maybe not:...........Sometimes the Bavarian bars were actually constructed this way (were made to be worn this way), and were actually sometimes worn in this fashion. I would not have believed it myself, except that the evidence exists in period photographs of soldiers.
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EK 1813 EK 1813 Winner photo
Schießplatzmeister replied to Djedj's topic in Germany: All Eras: The Iron Cross
And with a Russian St. George Cross also! A very interesting photo. -
Hello Chris: An interesting question! I can shed a bit of light on this as I have the following "Orden der bayer. Tapferkeitsmedaille" documentation in my collection: 1) An Aufnahme=Urkunde dated 1. Okt. 1924 for a Silver MVM/TKM recipient (one of only 11 Jewish Silver medal recipients). 2) An Aufnahme=Urkunde dated 30. April 1927 for a Silver MVM/TKM recipient. 3) A multi-colored printed "Ehrenurkunde" for an 1870/71 War veteran who was a Silver MVM/TKM recipient dated 15. September 1928. So, the organization was in existence as early as at least 1924. I do not believe that it was in existence prior to 1918. The organization was still in existence as late as 1969 as the organization published a 175 year history of the medal in that year. Sadly, I know of nothing after this date. As the majority of recipients were deceased in greater and greater numbers, it was impossible and not financially practical to keep the organization going. Members paid dues which paid for the costs of running the organization. Records do exist, but as the organization was private, there is no "official" archive that I know of. I have the complete records of a regional officer of the organization from several years during the 1950's. Sadly, it documents the decline of the organization as members were expiring. Best regards,
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Hello Alex: Yes, very interesting! He is definitely wearing his oak-leaves upside-down. But, who would have been so forward as to tell him such a thing? The photographer probably didn't know the difference, and if he did, he certainly would not have wanted to offend the subject of his photo. Best regards,
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Hello Claudio et. al.: The photo in question is of MMJO RK (MJ3) recipient Hermann Ritter von Speck. He was killed in action on 15th June 1940 at Pont sur Yonne France. Claudio, you are quite correct, Ritter von Speck was awarded the Chilean Merit Order. He was a military advisor and went to Chile and Argentina with General von Heye in the 1920's. I believe that he may have been General von Heye's adjutant, but I have not been able to locate much information regarding their trip. I don't believe that he was an ardent NSDAP member, but he was certainly a professional Officer. Due to his demise he was not around for any campaigns in the East after 1940 and therefore had nothing to do with the invasion of the Ukraine and any subsequent actions. Best regards,
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Hello Sergio: A very interesting medal group. In my opinion, the ribbon is NOT Bavarian. It is the same as the ribbon for Hessen-Darmstadt Arts and Sciences merit medals and for Hessen-Darmstadt Fire Brigade medals. It may be impossible to ever know exactly what was there originally. Perhaps our resident Hessian expert Rudi will have some ideas? Best regards,
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Hello Ulsterman: Sorry, to clarify, I meant "BMVK2x" when I wrote "MVKII with swords". But, I forgot to include the crown! So, it was really a Bavarian Military Merit Cross 2nd Class with Swords and Crown most likely. So, we are talking about the same thing. Thinking about Bavarian items all of the time, I often forget about the other States! Yes, there is the "Bayerns Goldenes Ehrenbuch" which has the citation information for the recipients listed. If there was a name to go with the field ribbon bar, then the citation information could be found there. Unfortunately, this WWI combination (Bavarian Military Merit Medal/Bravery Medal, Bavarian Military Merit Cross 2nd Class with Swords and Crown, and Prussian Iron Cross 2nd Class) was not that unique, so finding out which soldier owned this field ribbon bar would be difficult without any supporting documents/history. Best regards
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Hello Alan: Congratulations regarding this very nice field ribbon bar. The recipient was most likely a MVM/TKM recipient (gold or silver) in WWI. He was also most likely a MVK II with swords recipient. There is nothing to indicate that he was an Officer, or may have received a field grade promotion. The odds are therefore against him having been a MMJO (MJ3) recipient. Best regards
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Hello Westfale: I don't know what the regulations stated during this time, but this was a common practice. What is interesting here is that our brave Bavarian soldier has a TKM/MVM ribbon (and also an MVK and EK ribbon)! An with the EKI too! He definitely did something rather brave in combat at some point. Do you know his name? If so, I can look up his TKM/MVM citation information. Best regards
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Hello Chris: An excellent question. Based upon what I have seen, recipients were not guaranteed a civil service job, but if they were qualified, I believe that it certainly helped during the 3rd Reich to have been a MVM/TKM recipient. I have seen cases of many recipients who went on to become civil servants, and some who did not. Keep in mind however, if you were from a Jewish family and a TKM recipient, you were lucky if you were aloud to leave the country in the late 1930's. I have also seen the cases of political enemies of the State who were MVM/TKM recipients who were sent to Dachau for a few months to let them think about how erroneous their socialist ideals and activities were. I know of one Silber MVM/TKM recipient who was sent there twice! Best regards