Luftwaffe Luftwaffe RLM, Pioneer, and members attached to the Luftschutz

[Bob Lyons]

And another shot of one of the straps...

Bob

[Paul R]

Hi Bob!

Thanks for sharing those great shoulder boards. There were actually two cases where the "LS" cyphers were used. The case you mentioned and the second, with a black waffenfarbe, for LW men assigned to the Luftschultz.

This set you posted is actually the latter, a Luftwaffe NCO attached to the Luftschutz.

[nesredep]

Hi

This is really nicley presented.

Nesredep

[Naxos]

Para-Badge award to a Pionier

[Bob Lyons]

I had better add my latest aquisition in here also.

Bob

[Bob Lyons]

And just to add a little bit more about the above cap, as it turns out (thanks Gene) this cap is

a postwar put together, and as such I have returned it to the source in Germany that I was buying in from.

Bob

[Naxos]

"Pioneer and bautruppen, is that two words for the same thing? "

No, not really. In short: Pioniere (like Fallschirm-Pioniere) were combat troops used for attack of fortifications and clearing of mine fields. Baupioniere were Engineers that build and repaired structures like bridges. Both wore the black Waffenfarbe.

Regards, Hardy

Unusual post - I'm responding to one of my own posts to correct myself (well, partially anyway).

My statement above is correct - except were I say that Baupioniere and Fallschirmpioniere wore the same Waffenfarbe (black piping and tabs).

I now believe that Fallschirmj?ger of all trades with perhaps the exception of medical personell, wore the yellow Waffenfarbe.

Looking at pictures of my father I thought that his collar tabs were black during the time he was a combat engineer in a Fallschirm-Pionier-Bataillon. Later he was transfered to a Fallschirm-Panzer-J?ger-Abteilung and the pictures show a much lighter Waffenfarbe (yellow).

Since I never asked my father while he was alive, I assumed that once he was transferred from the combat engineers to a paratrooper anti tank battalion the black tabs were exchanged for yellow ones.

Last week I was scanning more of his pictures and noticed that in some pics the apparently black tabs seemed much lighter, I then checked pictures of flight officers of the Luftwaffe (yellow tabs) and noticed that very dark appearing tabs are not uncommon. That led me to start a thread over at the WAF.

http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/sho...ad.php?t=242698

To some of you this might be a non-event, but to me it's a discovery

Regards, Hardy

Edited September 25, 2007 by Naxos

[Snoopy]

Hello

This cloth patch might not have any relevance to this discussion, but I thought that I could show it anyway. It's the insignia of L-BAU (Luft-Bau). I have been told, that it was used on civillian work clothes, by civillians employed by the Luftwaffe, for construction jobs.

Snoopy

Edited February 1, 2008 by Snoopy

[Paul R]

Hello

This cloth patch might not have any relevance to this discussion, but I thought that I could show it anyway. It's the insignia of L-BAU (Luft-Bau). I have been told, that it was used on civillian work clothes, by civillians employed by the Luftwaffe, for construction jobs.

Snoopy

Hi Snoopy,

The patch is very relevant. It is a construction based LW civilian organization. I will have to do an article on those men as well!

I wanted to add my newest tunic to the thread.

Paul

[Paul R]

Insignia

[Paul R]

Harvy,

Very interesting read, on all accounts. I,for one, thought that Bautruppen were the same as pioneers. Why could color photography not been invented and perfected 7 years earlier....

[nesredep]

Hello!

Is this Bautruppen ? Thanks for help.

All the best

Nesredep

[nesredep]

Hello!

Back of the photo.Farsund a city of Norway.

All the best

Nesredep

[Paul R]

Thanks for the photo... It very would could be Bautruppen. Black and white photos are tricky!

[nesredep]

Thanks for the photo... It very would could be Bautruppen. Black and white photos are tricky!

Hello!

Paul R

Always glad to help.I agree black and white are tricky.

All the best

Nesredep

[Wessel]

Opinions, please, on these hand-sewn on black tabs on a white tunic. The shoulder boards are the removeable types.

I think the tunic is period, but unsure about the insignia.

Thanks

[Wessel]

..other tab.

[Wessel]

Tunic.

[Paul R]

The insignia looks beautiful to me.

[Ulsterman]

I have a couple of Luftschutz passbooks.

I've wondered, has anyone often encountered Luftwaffe members attached to the Luftschutz being awarded the Luftschutz medal?

[Scott]

Wessel, is the ribbon bar original to the original tunic owner? If so, do you have his name? (I'm working on a Legion Condor veteran project).

Thanks!

[Wessel]

Paul, thanks for your swift response.

Scott, you noticed the two Spanish awards!

The bar came with the tunic but it has no loops, just pinned through, and I do not know if it is original to the tunic. There are no markings of any kind (probably as one would expect) inside the tunic.

The buttons are Ludenscheid marked and have split pins on reverse.

A full frontal!

[Wessel]

Does anyone out there have a metal breast eagle (at a reasonable price!)?

[Harrier]

Paul,

Somewhere (and I will try to dig them out) I have some photos of Milch and, I believe, Goering, wearing black-backed tabs in pre-war times.

Best,

Harrier

[Harrier]

http://gmic.co.uk/uploads/monthly_01_2009/post-2778-1231370772.jpgPaul,

I'm not much good to you right this moment, but here is a sample of what I'm talking about. Many years ago, a friend of mine and I obtained over a hundred pages of contact sheets (positives) of photos taken by Goering's private photographer. We had these re-photographed by a professional photographer and then blown up. SOMEWHERE, I have all the envelopes of these photos, but I just can't get to them all right now. Here's a sample page of what we were dealing with.

Harrier