Ulsterman

Outstanding!!! That Commando mobilization photo is superb.

In a word- WOW!!!! Have you looked at his military file at all on ancestry?

Not technically correct Komtur, but I am not kidding. I also have the regs. Note when the regs for the medals were originally promulgated too. There was a gap of several months as I recall. There are two documented instances where field Doctors were originally awarded the combat medal and later the noncom. medal. One was the subject of an JOMSA article (which INCLUDED a US civil war campaign medal) and the other was on the WAF (via Detlev) about 3 years ago. One occurrence is a unique exception, twice may be a pattern.

Doctors received the noncomb. 1870-71 medal. there are a couple of "double award" document sets out there though that show that Doctors were originally given the "combat" version and later, the noncombat.

To briefly answer your questions: 1. I have no idea who General O'L. was, but Brice is noted as his ADC on his bio. card at the British Napoleonic RUSI card index. I infer that Brice was sent home to convalesce and ended up detached, but his card notes he rejoined his regt.. Of course O'L. may have been a Spanish general as well, as there were Irish Spaniards. The 23rd actually didn't have much of a rough time. The column mentioned was the 3rd one of D'Erlons' attack-massive yes, but they barely got off a volley before they were ridden down and dispersed by the Union Brigade and Horse Guards. The French cavalry initially passed in front of them, but were driven off (outnumbered 6:1). Later in the afternoon the "menacing" was from the tag end of the massive french cavalry attacks, which, being unsupported, were not really that threatening. Now if only one french Division had been moved up along with 2-3 batteries, Waterloo might have ended differently. There is a fascinating discussion on the Waterloo forum about company casualties of the 23rd and a VERY clever chap has been able to surmise the company template of the regimental square by the casualties. I do not know which company Brice was with, but the original muster rolls might show it. I have the older Officers roll call from 1965 which alas, does not show company assignments (sometimes).

Outstanding Robert!! outstanding!!

Um-may we see the edge stitching please? I would REALLY want to pick this one up and look at it closely.

Uh oh..... :speechless1:

I have LONG awaited a revised and expanded edition of V. Agers' now classic (and purloined) work. Excellent info! Thanks! Good to see you here.

Me neither-looks "Austrian" doesn't it?

Little to add-except these are classics and again, started life at Kellys'. Note the stitching pattern on the back. Most worrisome is that over the past year he has become good at furled ribbons AND he is using original imperial medals. TR medals are often re-strikes, but difficult to spot on an eBay photo. He likes to use tea and coffee as a stain. He has also begun to "fade" ribbons a bit. I suspect he is just leaving the bar/ribbons out in a window for a couple of months. ALWAYS sniff the bar (Rick taught me this). Some things can not be faked (well). Often original bars smell, well, old.

Hi Gordon. Alas, "no" to all questions.

That is outstanding!!! I had no idea that even existed!! I think the association is still around. It is very High C of E.....part of the Oxford Movement. I think its on Wikipedia. There was a chapter at the Anglican Walsingham shrine.

Yes-he is listed on the Waterloo roll as serving with his regiment as a Lieutenant. His full name was Alexander Adair Brice and he was made an Ensign on 8.8.1811. He was promoted to Lt. on May 21, 1812 and lightly wounded on July 28th, 1813 in the Pyrenees while serving in the 1st battalion. (London Gazette). He served as an ADC to H. G. T. O'Laughlin in 1813-`1814 and rejoined the 23rd in late 1814. At Waterloo the 23rd spent much of the day in square and was shot at frequently by French horse artillery. Towards the end of the battle one ball took out 25 men at once. One the whole though, the battalion didn't suffer extraordinary casualties. Brice went on half pay in 1820. Brice was listed in the Army List as a LT. of the 66th foot in the Yeomanry in 1860.

Well, Saxe Gotha troops definitely went into the North German confederation troop contingents. However, Saxe-Gotha Altenbrg. doesn't show up anywhere as a separate military entity. This makes me really wonder who got these and how and when. My guess is that they were lumped into Saxe Gotha, but given the size of the population of SGA at the time (85,000 at best), you have to wonder how many of these there really were. Whether SGA's contingent was also part of the Saxon army is also in interesting avenue of inquiry. The Saxons revolted against Prussian control and openly rioted in the streets before they were suppressed. About 40 soldiers were shot by firing squads and a number of very experienced and very pro-Bonaparte officers were cashiered. The two Saxon brigades were sent EAST into Germany- out of Belgium a mere fortnight before the campaign kicked off. Westphalian Landwehr troops served in the Waterloo campaign and all sorts of odd people were in some of these units: ex POWs etc. It's a mystery-but one well worth researching. Anyone know if there a SGA Court Handbuch out there?

I believe the SGA troops were -as a contingent-part of the same corps the Hessians were in. However, there were some odd units in Bluchers' army. Several actually went into battle wearing their old Confederation of the Rhine uniforms from 1813/14. I'll double check.

Well, is there any way to find out where the kaiser was on August 25, 1917? That will narrow down the regiment at least.

Nice one! I like the SshwRdlst. medals a lot. :cheers:

US marines do you mean?

what? where?

I think the last one with the red/white combo is the old Austrian red cross medal.

In a word- -wow! Is it made of real gold?

The "infamous Austrian" is a mentally unstable chap who has been producing medal bars for the past 15 years or so. Rumor has it he tried to commit suicide last year but failed, but he clearly is now back and getting better at what he does. Indeed, he may well be reading this website (and others) to perfect his craft. He is certainly evolving and getting better. He rarely makes mistakes in precedence any more. Many of his creations appear on eBay. He now works with Kellys' a reproduction company in Massachusetts. There are a number of tell-tale "signature" aspects to his bars, including construction and some other subtleties. I once went on a physical forensics course. One of the things I learned was that most people like a "standard operating procedure". These remembered habits, simple things like the way you butter toast, address an envelope or twist a wire are usually unique and so ingrained as habits, that to NOT do a task the habitual way is actually difficult. This guy has a number of "construction habits". About 10-12 years ago he produced a large number of "monster" bars many of which had a red felt backing (new too-it glowed). Later he built smaller bars which always seem to have a "come on" aspect-something attractive like an unusual foreign award or two. Sometimes the combinations are/were outlandish, but over the past 3-4 years some bars produced seem to be legit. until you see the construction "clues". His bars are getting smaller as the market now avoids monster bars except as a "price per medal" buy. If people aren't paying a "spangenbonus", then this guy isn't making a profit as with his imperial stuff he uses common medals. These days he seems to be mixing repro and common awards, which is what I saw on Sunday. The "Austrian" is not the only faker out there to be sure, but he is the most prolific and easy to spot....so far.

Exactly what I was attempting to see! It's definitely not the handiwork of the infamous Austrian! The bar looks good!

Jeepers! How on earth did that Swede get the third medal?