House Order of Hohenzollern - info needed

[Guest Rick Research]

Yeah, he must have gotten RAO4Kr as one single award just before the war.

[Deruelle]

Hi Daniel,

Here is the photo of Generalleutnant Karl Spang with interresting ribbon bar.

Christophe

[Deruelle]

Oberstleutnant Georg Hauss

Christophe

[Deruelle]

Another photo

[Deruelle]

A close up of the medal bar

Christophe

[Deruelle]

Unknown officer (for the moment)

Christophe

[Deruelle]

The last one for the moment

Christophe

[WNickel]

Sorry if this post don't suite here but I just start doing first "steps" on the range liste world. I don't know are you looking Hohenzollern inputs without X as well but here is one what I found on the civilians list....

Erwin Wendt...... POH3

Just lt me know is there any help of those and I will post more.

Hi,

can you the titel of your civilian list???

Merci

Werner

[Deruelle]

Hi Daniel,

in post # 109, Oblt J. Eckholt, the first name is Johannes

Regards

Christophe

[Deruelle]

Hi Daniel,

New date for you :

Major Lenz : HHO3X, 1st october 1916.

Christophe

[Noor]

Hauptmann Ernst Frey

3. Abt. Feld-Art.Reg. No.276

HHOX 15 Decemer 1918.

Edited April 13, 2009 by Noor

[The Prussian]

?Hello gentlemen!

I?ve got a nice photo of an Ulan-photo, taken in the Reichswehr-time.The Ulan in front is wearing the Hohenzollern House-order. It?s the Reiter-Regiment Nr.11. This regiment was the tradition-unit of the Ulan-regiment 15. Note the tradition-badge upon the upper arm of the soldier in the Reichswehr-uniform! Can anyone identify the owner of the order?

[GMU]

Hi,

I?ve had this since a long time ago. It came together.

I think the HHO is Ok, but I do not know about the ribbon bars. What is the black and white ribbon with the narrow black stripe in the middle? Assuming that the bars are Ok, could this be traceable, or the awards are too common?

Edited April 13, 2009 by GMU

[Guest Rick Research]

Ribbon bars are fine-- no worries.

Only four possible recipients of the 3 Orders on there from what we know from the Award Rolls--

Hauptmann aD (Pio Bn 14) Lothar Baas, of Feldflieger Abteilung 26

Oberleutnant aD Walter-Heinrich Garbsch (Fusilier Regt 40)

Hauptmann aD (Feldart Regt 14) Walter von Holst

or

Oberleutnant aD (1. Garde Regt zu Fuss) Siegfried von Woyrsch

The white and 3 black stripes is the PRINCIPALITY of Hohenzollern's Honor Cross-- the Catholic branch of the family's House Order. DOUBLE Prussian and Hohenzollern branch Hohenzollern House Orders are not at all common.

All 4 survived the 1914 war, hence their aD ranks as shown. It is possible as we add to the Award Rolls we have already published, several may be eliminated-- if they had Austro-Hungarian awards etc.

[GMU]

Ribbon bars are fine-- no worries.

Only four possible recipients of the 3 Orders on there from what we know from the Award Rolls--

Hauptmann aD (Pio Bn 14) Lothar Baas, of Feldflieger Abteilung 26

Oberleutnant aD Walter-Heinrich Garbsch (Fusilier Regt 40)

Hauptmann aD (Feldart Regt 14) Walter von Holst

or

Oberleutnant aD (1. Garde Regt zu Fuss) Siegfried von Woyrsch

The white and 3 black stripes is the PRINCIPALITY of Hohenzollern's Honor Cross-- the Catholic branch of the family's House Order. DOUBLE Prussian and Hohenzollern branch Hohenzollern House Orders are not at all common.

All 4 survived the 1914 war, hence their aD ranks as shown. It is possible as we add to the Award Rolls we have already published, several may be eliminated-- if they had Austro-Hungarian awards etc.

Thank you very much Rick. Interesting information about the double branch HHO award.

George

[Guest Rick Research]

There were only 60 recipients of both--in classes worn on a medal bar--during the World War. There were 164 recipients of the Princely Hohenzollern X and Baden's Z?hringen Lion with Xs during the war. But for all three (and no other German ribboned awards....) just those 4.

[The Prussian]

?Hello gentlemen!

I?ve got a nice photo of an Ulan-photo, taken in the Reichswehr-time.The Ulan in front is wearing the Hohenzollern House-order. It?s the Reiter-Regiment Nr.11. This regiment was the tradition-unit of the Ulan-regiment 15. Note the tradition-badge upon the upper arm of the soldier in the Reichswehr-uniform! Can anyone identify the owner of the order?

No idea for the young Ulan??? (Picture #137)

Edited April 14, 2009 by The Prussian

[GMU]

There were only 60 recipients of both--in classes worn on a medal bar--during the World War. There were 164 recipients of the Princely Hohenzollern X and Baden's Z?hringen Lion with Xs during the war. But for all three (and no other German ribboned awards....) just those 4.

Hi Rick,

Thanks for your kind help.

I assume that the 3-ribbon bar predates the 4-ribbon bar. Therefore, the Prussian HHOX was received after the Princely Hohenzollern X and Baden's Z?hringen Lion with Xs.

Would the order in which he got these awards help us out rule one or more of the other candidates? I mean, since the two HHOs could be earned independently one from the order, it is possible that some candidates could have received the Prussian HHO first and then the Princely HHO, right?

George

[Guest Rick Research]

They all got the HEK3X and BZ3bX early in the war and the HOH3X later so no help there, I'm afraid. 1 of 4--out of the entire Imperial German officer corps--is the best I can do. :cheers:

[GMU]

They all got the HEK3X and BZ3bX early in the war and the HOH3X later so no help there, I'm afraid. 1 of 4--out of the entire Imperial German officer corps--is the best I can do.

1of 4 out of the entire Imperial German service is simply outstanding Rick. That is no easy task indeed.

Thank you very much for your help and knowledge!

George

[Roman Slivin]

:cheers:

[Noor]

One simple pure WW1 period ribbon bar:

1. HOHX

2. EK2

3. Long Service

4. BMVO

5. SLK

Not trackable but can I be sure that the owner of this bar was more likely from 26th Brigade of Army Corps VII (where was as well Westf?lisches J?ger-Bataillon Nr.7) because the Schaumburg-Lippe connection?

Can it be Leutnant Karl E Sch?fer (please don't laugh now.... my first steps on this strange and hard tracking field) because I found out that he got HHOX/EK2/BMVO4X/SLK? KIA 1917. Just don't know does he got KO as well?

[Guest Rick Research]

Very nice bow. Double Royal and Princely Hohenzollerns are quite scarce, especially at this level-- he was a Major during the war. Alas, he has chosen NOT to wear all of his awards. Very neta to wear only his "Prussian" stuff... but makes identification impossible. All recipients of the three Orders shown had other awards too.

I have never seen a Hohenzollern before an Iron Cross before the "anything goes" Weimar period. So whoever that belonged too was alive in the 1920s. Feldgrau backings remained in dealer stock well into the 1930s. From the "pure Prussian" mounting order (Weimar version, wrong but understandable) that must have been a Prussian Crown Order 4 in the middle. Probably not enough of a trio (HOH3X, KO4, BMV4X) to make an identification possible, even with Daniel's vastly improved Hohenzollern rolls and Bernd's Bavarian rolls to appear in print soon:

No SLK rolls, so can only find Reichswehr officers and people with award documents that turn up.

Sometimes you just have to settle for a great combination in outstanding condition.

[Guest Rick Research]

Very nice bow. Double Royal and Princely Hohenzollerns are quite scarce (60), especially at this level-- he was a Major during the war. Alas, he has chosen NOT to wear all of his awards. Very neat to wear only his "Prussian" stuff... but makes identification impossible. All recipients of the three Orders shown had other awards too.

I have never seen a Hohenzollern before an Iron Cross before the "anything goes" Weimar period. So whoever that belonged too was alive in the 1920s. Feldgrau backings remained in dealer stock well into the 1930s. From the "pure Prussian" mounting order (Weimar version, wrong but understandable) that must have been a Prussian Crown Order 4 in the middle. Probably not enough of a trio (HOH3X, KO4, BMV4X) to make an identification possible, even with Daniel's vastly improved Hohenzollern rolls and Bernd's Bavarian rolls to appear in print soon:

No SLK rolls, so can only find Reichswehr officers and people with award documents that turn up.

Sometimes you just have to settle for a great combination in outstanding condition.

[saschaw]

Rick, I do not see a Hohenzollern Double on Roman's bow. Isn't that just and EK2 with a Hohenzollern anything?!

Here's one of mine HOH3X bars, but I'm pretty unsure... MEZ2, KO4X/RAO4X plus HOH3X and EK2, leaving out all China, Africa or Kolonial medals etc. Might be a phantasy put together bar... I'm not sure... Rick?!

Edited April 30, 2009 by saschaw